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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

It may make you feel good to trash progressives but can you honestly defend the choices we are given every election? As a progressive, I did vote for Biden and knew exactly the trash heap I would be getting in order to sweep out the other trash heap in the White House. This is what our elections have become.

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The Dandy Highwayman's avatar

You're not a Progressive if you voted for Biden, dumbass.

Progressives aren't on board with his War Machine bullshittery, and neither are "right wingers".

This is the Machine.

This guy above is confused, as you are and you're all really in the same camp: The Unwashed Masses.

The trash heap is a swirl of red and blue. Really, it's a purple plutocracy.

You.... and the guy complaining about "Progressives" are both fooled.

Get UNfooled, cracka.

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the long warred's avatar

Funny, cracka being the only approved racial slur.

But itтАЩs fine; lets have it in the open, weтАЩll only demand and enforce reciprocity.

And we are unfooled.

A mistake to take away the fig leaf of voting.

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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

IтАЩm sure youтАЩre just a gem when it comes to persuading others to your point of view.

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Indecisive decider's avatar

Berta, you knew you voted for a dumpster fire because you felt the other choice was a bigger dumpster fire.

This thinking is EXACTLY why we'll never get out of this loop.... too many people convinced to buy into mythology. I get it. I bought into it for a long time, too.

If you want progress forward, expecting it from people holding things back is nonsense. You have to take a risk with your vote. That means not voting Democratic party candidates.

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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

YouтАЩre right. CanтАЩt stand Biden but canтАЩt stand Trump either and when I see the list of potential 2024 candidates , itтАЩs just depressing. I keep hoping for some massive awakening of the population but it just seems the majority are willing to live life in an ever shrinking set of possibilities. To be honest, I donтАЩt know the answer but for now unless something drastic changes, no more votes for mainstream democrats at the top unless the party remakes itself into one that serves the people and until the leadership changes I donтАЩt see that happening.

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Nobody's avatar

What incentive do D's and R's have to offer anything better when you willingly vote for them, every time.

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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

And if you donтАЩt vote, they donтАЩt care about that either

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Nobody's avatar

You're right, which is why not voting is a bad idea. Vote 3rd party even if they stink. If you must, write in someone. Several million votes for Boaty McBoatface would make a statement.

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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

I think the only way any of this works is if itтАЩs coordinated so it sends a message. As individuals, both parties can just ignore it. After all around 40 - 60% of people already donтАЩt vote. As for third parties, itтАЩs going to be hard because of who controls the media - although I think thatтАЩs changing and maybe it just needs the right candidate

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Indecisive decider's avatar

There shouldn't be any voting for any incumbent.... ever. The political parties epitomize what personal destructive relationships resemble - one person abusing the other but expecting to be treated like royalty. Don't enable this behavior.

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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

I think there are exceptions but generally that seems a good idea

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Carol Jones's avatar

DONT VOTE

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The Dandy Highwayman's avatar

I'm not trying to persuade anyone.

I'm just a gem.

Also... most people are shit-heels and I don't care. Really.

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User's avatar
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Dec 15, 2020
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Carol Jones's avatar

exactly!

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Nobody's avatar

False dichotomy. There were multiple 3rd party candidates, and of course you can always write in Mickey Mouse. You were told that anything was better than Trump, and like a sucker you bought the lie. If enough people start voting 3rd party then maybe we'll get some better choices. There probably would've been a bigger bill under Trump, he was at least a populist. Enjoy the next 4 years, you deserve what you get good and hard. And i'm sure you'll line up again next election cycle just as your told, ready to throw away your vote.

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JazzPaw's avatar

I voted for Biden knowing that nothing will get done during his term. I and 80M others were tired of the things that were being done by the Orange Menace. ItтАЩs as simple as that.

IтАЩm a sometime progressive who has concluded that this country is ungovernable at the federal level, and should probably break up. In the absence of the good sense that it would take to accomplish such a break-up, IтАЩd rather have nothing get done and ideally for the federal government shrink severely.

Judging by the comments I read here and elsewhere, the citizens of the US are ill-informed and have unrealistic ideas about what government can do to make up for the poorly managed lives of the citizens.

Biden will get nothing done outside of what he can order the executive branch to do. Fine with me. And he will order things to be done that will he less menacing than what Trump has done over the last four years, so I voted for him. Not a hard choice!

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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

Yeah - I think a lot of people thought it out and reached the conclusion that Trump had to go . That doesn't mean we are fooled into thinking Biden will do anything beyond the usual not much. It's a pathetic state of affairs really.

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Carol Jones's avatar

How about not voting? how about taking that time, money, resources and helping people in your local neighbourhood. Building up local supports and services. Geez you guys really drink the koolaid

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User's avatar
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Dec 15, 2020
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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

Agreed. I donтАЩt defend it. I could have gone with Green, not voting but I knew factually what Trump was doing as far as economic sanctions, the environment, refugees, increase in weapons sales, the disaster with COVID and more. Things I felt had to stop. I view Biden as a faulty set of brakes on a runaway car. They may fail but what we had - had to go.

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Carol Jones's avatar

how about not voting-hello-- free will??? good god.

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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

My vote was free will. I thought about all the options and came to the best conclusion I could. It doesnтАЩt mean I think itтАЩs perfect - Two bad choices preclude a perfect decision. Not voting wouldnтАЩt have been a perfect decision either in my opinion. The only way that works to change anything is if thereтАЩs an organized mass movement and there wasnтАЩt. Random people not voting does what?

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Indecisive decider's avatar

There is no perfect choice, but voting for faulty brakes - to use your analogy - doesn't pass the sniff test either.

If voters really are tired of this garbage, their votes have to reflect that sentiment. Otherwise it's just yelling at the clouds.

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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

ItтАЩs yelling at the clouds no matter what we do

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Indecisive decider's avatar

You could have voted for a 3rd party candidate. You could have gotten involved in the primaries. You could have gotten involved in local elections.

There are things we all can do that don't involve yelling or clouds.

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Nobody's avatar

I disagree. TPTB definitely had their feathers ruffled when Trump won. He wasn't supposed to win. Not that i'm saying he was any good mind you, but Trump and Brexit were big shocks to the 1% back in 2016. If nothing else the collective meltdown of our press and ruling class was entertaining.

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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

I agree Trump is more entertaining than Biden although we do have to give him time but as far as governing which is the point, he was a disaster. And heтАЩs a very wealthy entitled person - how is he not of the ruling class with the exact interests of the ruling class?

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Nobody's avatar

He is of the elite, but he was not chosen by the elite to be the next president. He was allowed by the elite to run because they believe him to to be so unpalatable that Hillary would be guaranteed to win. There are emails in the wikileaks dump pretty much saying exactly this. Hillary was just so unlikable and saddled with baggage that she lost to Trump. Barely, but she lost. She and her paymasters were too out of touch with the public to realize how unpopular globalism and the forever wars were.

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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

Maybe. I'm not sure because the elite have managed to stop Bernie twice and I'm sure they would've preferred Jeb or Marco. I agree they probably did expect Hillary to win - pretty much everyone did. The reality of Trump is optics aside he's your standard issue Republican - tax cuts, deregulation, policies meant to favor corporations and the wealthy with a side of racial/immigrant / nationalistic dog whistles. He put his own spin on it but the end results are basically the same. Right wing of the Democratic Party at this point is more aligned with these policies too.

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Koshmarov's avatar

I think Biden will become more and more entertaining for what will probably become an increasingly shorter period of time, unless they are fully committed to the Max Headroom presidency.

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Nobody's avatar

I sure hope you're right. The situation is so awful I need some comic relief. Trump provided that in spades.

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Berta G Gutierrez's avatar

Well, letтАЩs hope so since we canтАЩt expect much of a constructive nature, the least they can do is entertain us..

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