59 Comments

Isn’t the county mentioned a cesspool of progressivism? Why not, since more government is always seen as the perfect panacea, create another layer of over site; and while at it, increase county taxes by at least 25%?

That will fix it!

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It's a cesspool of authoritarianism brought about by both fake ideological traps.

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Yes, but PG County went all in for the Donkeys. What are libertarians/conservatives/rational people to do when certain populations demand a political voice (perfectly normal/the right of all citizens), achieve a political voice/majority (demographics), and then refuse to acknowledge that the source of their empowerment is in their own hands when things are still messed up in a one party dominated political unit of their own choosing.

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Still singing the conservative victim song ? There's a reason republicans don't ever lead. They are always trying to return everyone to feudalism. Ever check the 3rd cannon of the conservative movement ?

Maybe not starting illegal wars or writing the Patriot act or actively contributing to everything you accuse the dems of might give folks an option ?

After all, calling folks who think the world was nirvana for everyone back in the 1780's can only call themselves rational.

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A shameful lack of due process for folks merely accused. Most especially done by "judges". Constitutional cowards it would seem. Small men (and women) with oversized authority.

That said, if Matt's figures on prisoner infection and death are accurate, the rate of death/infection in jails is 0.67% whereas the rate of death/infection in the population at large in the US is 3 times higher at 1.8% Either the data is wrong (or my math is) or folks seem safer, as to Covid, in jail than on the streets.

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The numbers are and have been all over the place from the beginning. We're not supposed to know how many people are effected and or die so they can fear monger us to the utmost.

Follow the money and you'll see what I mean.

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Agree on the lack of coherent data on this issue. The "died with Covid" equals "die from Covid" stuff fo pandemic porn purposes further skews things.

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The CDC released a report saying the infection rate is likely 7x what is being reported-roughly 1/3 of the population or 110 million cases.

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The fact that the study say's "likely" is all you really need to pay attention to.

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Because the prison population trends much younger, this stat makes sense. Actually CDC says for those under 60-70, the fatality rate is >1%.

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Interesting, though prison populations, arrests, etc., tend to bias toward poor and minority communities. Not sure that CDC stat applies to this sub cohort. Plus, if CDC said its ">" 1% for youngsters, that just echoes what I wrote above. If instead you meant "<" then my last sentence applies.

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oops. meant <.

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And from what I have learned through almost obsessive research is that minority populations are over-represented in fatalities but those deaths are primarily among the older members in those populations. There are stats on the CDC website that break this down, but you have to dig. And also, death from Covid for those under 40 are not nil but almost, no matter what population group. Average age of prisoners is well below 40 and according to BOP, about 30% are over 40.

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Blaming human/civil rights violations on 'systemic failures' grants nebulous cover to the actors involved. 'The man', 'the system', 'the government' all consist of individuals who are committing illegal/unethical acts. But in this day and age, if you're active in decision-making/execution of systemic failures its not your fault, you are a victim as much as those the system is failing--in other words, no one who is perpetuating the system is punished.

Take this to the next level, with the incoming administration, it will only get worse. "We tortured some folks" but "let's look forward" and not backwards will continue. The people will grow more angry, and when the next strongman comes around, one who isn't a bombastic buffoon but one who does not shy in getting medieval, even biblical, cutting the baby in half without remorse in the name of justice, they will eagerly vote him into power to curb the bureaucracy's blasé malfeasance.

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This reminds me of the Robo-signing of mortgages into default during the 2008 financial crisis. That is, mortagage officers signed off without any review, in spite of the attestation that it was reviewed. Robo-signing is fraudulent, pure and simple. Yet to my knowledge no one was ever prosecuted for this.

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Ah, the old Linda Green signatures. No one ever had to do anything except stick out their hand for relief, even foreign banks. And Ben "Uncle Bumblefuck" Bernanke said it wasn't our business to know who was getting everything.

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Are you sure the people that blew the whistle weren't arrested ? That seems to be par for the course now days.

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And the elite will scatter like cockroaches to join their money within the confines of their bunkers hidden in the tax havens spread out across the globe.

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Here's a great (and long) write up on for-profit prisons, which have certainly contributed to more misery: https://dillonreadandco.com/prisons/

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Dec 14, 2020
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The entire government is fake so I really see no point in it. No one who believes in the two party hustle will ever have enough evidence not to believe in the two party hustle.

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Add the crime of not wearing a mask.

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As the Seattle Times editorial points out, https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.seattletimes.com/opinion/editorials/reject-seattles-absurd-misdemeanor-proposal/%3famp=1, civil society must preserve public safety and justice for everyone. In practice, at warp speed, decriminalizing poverty became decriminalizing crime, too expansive and facile in its interpretations -- see, again, Seattle or San Francisco. Or other places.

Addressing non-violent drug offenses and double standards for which blacks saw jail cells far more than whites is fair, as is directing these kids toward programs, not jail. In my town, our garbage cannot be left out overnight, or we're fined. Nobody leaves it out. There's a speed trap on the parkway allowing a certain borough to bolster its budget. On ticket day, the place is standing room only--the apprehended, incidentally, are overwhelmingly white. If we are to have two standards of law enforcement, of justice, one for law abiding citizens, the other not, if we decriminalize property and even some assault crimes, then America is over. Let's raise related standards, not destroy them. That's a thesis in itself, one that requires a two-way discussion, not the unilateral orthodox lecture that swamps our press and airwaves. Forget the law abiding shop owner in a dicey area whose place is habitually robbed.

Should he or she, if alive, grin and bear it? What kind of or degree of justice is meted out to single mothers or working parents trying to raise kids in crime-ridden neighborhoods, or babies and adults shot dead watching TV in their own homes, or in their own cars? Where is the movement to protect any of them? Instead, they get the begrudging sentence fragment, the token, "of course they matter but.."

When the law1 abiders finally do matter, things will change. Forget the people who build businesses, or own cars and homes or the old person coldcocked in the street. What's a burglary or two? A third degree assault? Yelling religious slurs at a succession of victims, or spitting, shouting, putting on a psychotic break performance, in a policeman's face? Piffle.All should bear it stoically, in the name if justice, and get these people right back on the street, so they can go out and do it again. Examples of injustice are important; it is unthinkable that anyone would spend a year in jail without due process. That is un-American. But such instances are highlighted not to say manipulated in campaigns for one size fits all leniency and de facto decriminalization of crime. There's little or no mention of what the accused allegedly did, to whom or what. In addition to the insanity of Herbold's Seattle proposal, New York's bail reform https://cbs6albany.com/news/local/recent-tragedy-sparks-criticism-of-new-yorks-bail-reform-plans.

decriminalized crime. Victim groups, the people daily affected by criminal behavior, and those seeking less incarceration for offenders should arrive at a joint solution, case by case bases, that keeps. Our civil and safe society at the forefront of our daily lives. Especially in our cities, where these non-negotiable bulwarks are degraded daily.

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On the other hand, bail reform is meant to address the inequities in the bail system. Those who can afford it, get out. Those that can't, don't. Pre-trial risk assessment based primarily on algorithm tools is the law of the near future as more jurisdictions switch to this method. In states or counties without pre-trial risk assessment, many poor defendants who cannot afford bail remain incarcerated unless they come up with the money. With risk assessment, at least some will be released without bail or with conditions in lieu of money. Yes, the tools are new and imperfect and the algorithms and the bureaucracy may need serious tweaking. But we shouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

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Other than judges passing the buck, which doesn’t surprise me, I don’t see this as much of an issue.

Prisoners are at risk of Covid...so is everyone else. Google ‘released covid prisoners committing crimes’ and you will get 14,000,000 results. Young prisoners are unlikely to die from the disease as your numbers indicate: 99.7% recovered. And where exactly are old prisoners going to go? There are no ‘covid free zones’ nor are there relatives waiting to put Uncle Ned, the criminal, up for the duration.

If you are in need of interesting ideas try: Civil Forfeiture and Police Department funding.

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Nit: extra space before "We have people..."

Great stuff. Please keep talking to PDs.

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Fair treatment for low-lifes, irresponsible kids and foreign nationals seems to be the main constituency of progressive politics. Not that the points Matt makes aren't valid, but you won't will elections with this kind of focus.

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Most of the real low lives are running the show. Take a look around the world and you'll see how low lives are needed to make excuses to bomb countries into oblivion just to eliminate competition for the elite and their exploitation of everyone and everything.

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whataboutism isn’t a winning debate point. nobody likes losers, And the sooner you face up to that, the sooner you may begin to have an impact on the world.

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Because committing war crimes and massive fraud makes you a winner ? I think we understand now why society is in a tail spin when we read comments like yours that show the sheer ignorance of some of the population when it comes to due process.

Not to mention your judgemental generalization of people not privileged enough to be able to buy their way out of the consequences.

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What great impact have you had on the world radrave ?

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Low-lifes, like "radrave", seem to think "fair treatment" is progressive. What about it "radrave"? What's been your impact?

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So if you're arrested, you're automatically a low-life? Or only if you're of certain colors or socio-economic classes? I'm sure the gods in their infinite wisdom place people exactly where they belong to be born, possibly based on crimes and sins from a previous life or failure to be one of "the Elect." Or something. You, born into abject poverty would undoubtedly have risen to your current 'superior' status from which you're suited to judge just who the low-lives are.

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Usually it's the ones that complain about huge swaths of society being inferior that are the worst criminals. Especially the ones that are too dim witted to understand the importance of due process for their own good.

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The abject ignorance and stupidity of progressives explains your current position in the political sphere

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«you're automatically a low-life? Or only if you're of certain colors or socio-economic classes?»

The people Matt Taibbi is talking about are those that get arrested, don't have enough money for bail, can't afford a lawyer and get instead a public defender, and can't even afford an internet (telephone) line at home.

For many middle and upper class voters, those are not "our own", they are just the servant classes.

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You have a comic book view of how the world works.

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Must be a very realistic comic: maybe a Classics Illustrated? Your epithet hurling, on the other hand, isn't exactly a riposte to anyone's criticisms of your comments. Like so many people these days, you write as if you're brilliant and your antagonists are all fools. Were that the case, you wouldn't feel the need to reply to all of them or you'd at least have something better than schoolyard insults. In any event, it's clear you're not going to actually respond substantively, generally a sign of someone who just likes baiting others and blowing smoke. Have fun with that.

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Not to idiotic comments, no.

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No one in pretrial detention has been convicted of anything, by definition. Arbitrary policing is very unpopular with voters, whereas due process is very popular. Do you mean elections that are purchased by police unions and the wealthy donors they exist to protect?

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I mean most people who vote do not have any contact with the police or justice system at all. So while there may be sympathy for the mess Matt describes, it just isn't a major factor in most people's voting. Most voter also do not share your belief that the police only protect "wealthy donors." That is a ludicrous assertion.

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But "people who vote" is already a category that is designed to favor people who are doing OK under the current settlement (there's a reason Election Day is on a weekday, that voter registration is not automatic, that lines are shorter in wealthy neighborhoods, etc). And the police absolutely devote more resources to protecting property owners than they do to the propertyless; the history of modern police forces beginning in early Victorian London has everything to do with managing the symptoms of that inequity (obviously, this is not the conscious motivation for any particular police officer, and I don't mean to suggest there's a conspiracy)

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Property owners yes, "wealthy donors only" no. I know that many blacks etc. in poor neighborhoods who own their homes also want the police around. There was a spate of black on black killings in the town next door last week which is very unusual for this area. The police held a well-attended public meeting on what to do about it. A major role of the police IS to protect property and prevent violent crime. I don't see a problem with this in the abstract. The issues around uneven implementation are another rather complex matter.

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I don't doubt that you do, but those are not prevailing opinions in black communities on policing and home-ownership, because the statistics here are appalling (the latter never being even close to an equal opportunity investment in the US). https://news.gallup.com/poll/317114/black-white-adults-confidence-diverges-police.aspx ; https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/07/23/black-homeownership-gap/?arc404=true

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It's hard to say what this poll refers to. The question they asked was about "confidence" in police, which could mean a lot of different things, including a desire for more police presence, and does not necessarily refer to attitudes about their role in society generally. That poll was also conducted right after the George Floyd death, with all the media hype, and probably focused on major cities, though they don't say. Seems you want to take it at face value as a general truth, though. You may want to ask yourself why.

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Good script for a musical comedy.

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"Its lawyers say nobody has been detained in violation of a court order.” You'd think that *detaining* would need to be affirmatively authorization. The universe of court orders not issued, and therefore not susceptible to being violated, is infinite.

Also, did 249k inmates 'contract the disease' or test positive without having contracted anything that resembles a disease?

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I think Jails since they are so expensive should be responsible for the health and well being of their prisoners. I mean criminally liable. Meaning if you are hit in the face by a prisoner then you were assaulted by the jail. The jail should face criminal liability. Your sentence is your confinement and removal from society not being raped and beaten.

Also, I believe that before you are convicted of a crime the jail should be like a hotel room, a TV, a comfortable bed and a telephone you are free to use at no cost. After all before you are convicted you are in fact an innocent man being detained simply for the benefit and convenience fo the law.

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Great news update. I live in the area and didn't know this.

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«If you’re not from Prince George’s County but get arrested there [...] buy the equivalent of a political options contract as an alternative to judgment.»

This seems to imply that those judges are elected, and it is their constituents that are are quite happy with very long detention times both pre-trial and afterwards.

If that is the case the system is working exactly is intended: electing judges is supposed to ensure that they conform to the values of their community, and if their constituents are nasty hypocrites, then is it a surprise that the justice system conforms to that?

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Kafka meets Catch 22. But as far as the Covid commentary goes, by the numbers presented here the generally not so healthy prison population has about 1/3 better death rate per 100,000 than US population as a whole.

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thank you

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