You're treating The NY Times like a news agency and it's not.
For years, it's been Pravda for the Dim Party; a way for the inner party to communicate the new party line, for the outer party to reconcile the contradictions, and the general membership to get its two minutes of hate.
That it's now functioning as a way to send messages to foreign adversaries is no surprise. That's exactly what Pravda did for the Soviet Communist Party; put it in black and white so even the Ivy League incompetents at the CIA can't miss it.
The NY Times is the definition of fake news; nothing in it is an attempt to genuinely inform the public. Hasn't been for at least 15 years.
It really is. I still haven't read the piece, but if as Matt and Walt say, that piece isn't for us, but for Putin, then that's as cut and dried a case of direct stenography as you'll find. No reporting involved.
In late August, 1619, 20-30 enslaved Africans landed at Point Comfort, today's Fort Monroe in Hampton, Va., aboard the English privateer ship White Lion. In Virginia, these Africans were traded in exchange for supplies. The 1619 Project claims that this event was the true founding of America, even though the slavers were clearly British privateers. They claim that this lead to “Systemic Racism” in the United States regardless of the stated principles of human liberty in the declaration of independence.
And this 1619 Project paper; The 1619 Project: A New Origin Story by Nikole Hannah-Jones published and promoted by the NYTimes won a Pulitzer Prize for Commentary!! This is fake history to claim this as America’s origin story. The origin of the United States of America was in 1776 with the publishing of the Declaration of Independence.
And then there is another story in the NYTimes: The Constitution Is Broken and Should Not Be Reclaimed (Aug. 19, 2022). By Ryan D. Doerfler and Samuel Moyn
"Keeping Faith with the Constitution" is a new publication of the American Constitution Society that presents a compelling and common-sense approach to constitutional interpretation – one that is faithful to the Constitution’s words and principles and that explains why it is the world’s most enduring written constitution. The book, authored by scholars Goodwin Liu, Pamela S. Karlan, and Christopher H. Schroeder, examines the text and history of the Constitution to show how the Framers inscribed the fundamental values of liberty, equality, and democracy into the document. It then describes and defends an approach to interpreting the Constitution the authors call “constitutional fidelity,” which, as the Framers envisioned, applies the Constitution’s broad principles to the changing needs, conditions, and understandings of our society. This dynamic process of constitutional interpretation, the book shows, has brought about the greatest legal achievements in our history, has allowed us to meet new challenges and unforeseen circumstances, and has enabled each generation of Americans to keep faith with the Constitution.
Keeping Faith with the Constitution | ACS
Keeping Faith with the Constitution Author(s): Pamela S. Karlan, Goodwin Liu & Christopher H. Schroeder " Keeping Faith " examines the text and history of the Constitution to show how the Framers inscribed the fundamental values of liberty, equality and democracy into the document. The authors describe what they call "constitutional fidelity," a principle that "serves not only to preserve the Constitution's meaning over time, but also to maintain its authority and legitimacy. The words and principles of the Constitution endure as our fundamental law because they have been made relevant to the conditions and challenges of each generation through an ongoing process of interpretation." By considering constitutional interpretation through history, the authors show that their approach has enabled our nation's greatest advances, from Brown v. Board of Education to women's rights, free speech, the Miranda decision, and the New Deal, emphasizing that our Constitution "reflects, in a spare outline, the moral trajectory of a nation continually striving for greater justice." Oxford University Press released an updated version of "Keeping Faith" as part of its acclaimed Inalienable Rights series in 2010. Download entire book It Is a Constitution We Are Expounding: Collected Writings on Interpreting Our Founding Document Along with Keeping Faith With the Constitution , ACS also has published a companion volume, entitled " It Is a Constitution We Are Expounding: Collected Writings on Interpreting Our Founding Document ." This book, with a Foreword by Professor Laurence H. Tribe , contains excerpts from some of the finest existing writing on methods of constitutional interpretation, taken from decisions of the Supreme Court and other opinions and speeches by Justices and judges, the scholarly literature, and other sources. The materials gathered in this volume explore a variety of interpretive resources that can help illuminate the Constitution’s meaning, including its text, structure, and history, the shared values it embodies, judicial precedent, and the consequences a particular interpretation is likely to have. Like Keeping Faith – whose authors drew upon many of the ideas presented in this volume – this publication presents "accepted tools of interpretation; that are faithful to the Constitution. Download It is a Constitution We Are Expounding: Collected Writings on Interpreting Our Founding Document Both books are designed to be useful to a wide readership, including law students, lawyers, judges, and every citizen engaged in the nation’s debates over the Constitution, the courts, and judicial nominations. Read more here . Keeping Faith Fact Sheet and FAQs "Keeping Faith with the Constitution" is a new publication of the American Constitution Society that presents a compelling and common-sense approach to constitutional interpretation – one that is faithful to the Constitution’s words and principles and that explains why it is the world’s most enduring wr
This is clearly the more rational and reasonable argument of the two considering it does not outright call for eliminating constitutional law from the republic.
The question becomes; why has the “Gray Lady” the estimable New York Times lobby for the elimination of 1776 as the date of America’s founding, and why does it now lobby for elimination the U.S. Constitution? Could it be that us conservative commentators have been correct in asserting that the NYTimes is a Neo-Marxist Uber-Liberal radical rag propagating revolution against the American republic? How could any reasonable person doubt it?
Joe Biden Gives The Most Dangerous Presidential Speech In Modern History:
Anyone else worried the U of A is going to pull some crazy false flag shenanigans in order to spur an official war declaration? Worked so well a decade ago…
Hi Emily - you may be over the target. In my youth I read with outrage about North Vietnam's unprovoked attack on a US warship in the Gulf of Tonkin, only to find out many years later that this was a "false flag". Given this event was the pretext for fully engaging in what came to be known as the Vietnam War, this was a big deal. We should pray this does not happen again.
Also - note the irony. I read about both versions of the event in the same newspapers. It was just that the conflicting versions were separated by a number of years.
It was then that people started to look back and focus on Pearl Harbor and Iraq. Was 9/11 started with a False Flag (Twin Towers). Today there are still people who think the US knew about it. It was the Israelis who were famous for false flags.
FBI report "Israelis Dancing" about a white truck parked in an apartment building parking lot from early in the morning. Watching the Twin Towers and taking their pictures of each other ON top of that van with the Towers in the back ground. When the planes hit, they began wildly dancing and celebrating in the parking lot.
It was so obviously a controlled demolition. When they got away with that and installed the patriot act, we became a national security state. The old USA died that day. You are no longer allowed to know what your government does
Good question. I think it’s entirely possible, but it would take something scary, followed by the usual propaganda BS you’re guaranteed from most mainstream media.
False flag to get the rah rah going for war. It’s worked before. Will it this time? I’m doubtful. What I don’t doubt is there will be plenty of confusion.
Seems as though the false flag has already started. First blowup a pipeline then a bridge ( in Crimea)! Putin has amazing patience in part due to his discipline in martial arts. Learned this from watching 3 part series by Oliver Stone interviewing Putin. Good luck finding it now.
I'd like to hear an explanation from your fevered brain why "patient and peaceful Putin" invaded Ukraine in the most naked agression since Hitler marched into the Sudetland?
You probably don't care because you get the roubles, but do you know you hurt your country with these bad propaganda posts?
They make Russia even more laughable than it's bad battlefield performance.
I sort of wondered whether the Nord Stream explosions were done partly as a false flag. I know that the main thing the US would get out of doing it would be a Russia incapable of supplying gas to Europe/threatening to turn the gas off if Europe crossed them, and a desperate Europe having no choice but to buy American gas exports instead. But with American insistence that Russia did this on purpose, they get to say "OMG, look at how cruel Vladimir Putin is! He's ensuring Europeans will freeze this winter, and he's even destroyed the means to get gas to them again if he changes his mind! Clearly, this man is evil and we have to remove him from power by any means necessary!"
You know, it's not easy to surprise me if you're part of Blue MAGA, but implying that you believe invading Iraq was justified? Yeah, that surprises me.
What doesn't surprise me is that you look at a war which was the equivalent of Mike Tyson in his prime fighting a toddler, and you're dumb enough to chalk up Saddam losing to bad strategy.
That’s a grim life you must lead, wishing a horrible fate upon a person, and revealing insane bloodlust at the same time. Put your phone down and go for a walk. Maybe listen to some nice Tchaikovsky? 😂
PS: not wanting to go to war doesn’t make you a troll. Although let’s hope more people are enlightened enough to realize this. I have my doubts.
Lol, last I saw it wasn't RUSSIAN territory getting annexed.
Anyway, if America and its allies getting away with war crimes was going to send me into an alcoholic tailspin, then I would have been drinking a fifth every day starting in 2003 and continuing for however long it would take for me to actually die as I saw stories about regime change in Libya, about attempted regime change in Syria reducing much of the country to rubble and human entrails, about Obama's (and then Trump's, and then Biden's) drone war blowing up weddings and innocent families because according to Michael Hayden they kill people based on metadata, about all the countries we're sanctioning and US officials probably agreeing with the late and unlamented Madeleine Albright when she said that killing hundreds of thousands of children via sanctions was always "worth it", etc.
When dipshits like you are happy to ignore ALL of that and only get upset (or pretend to be upset if you're getting paid to argue in bad faith that America is angelic and pure) when some other country slaughters people or commits human rights abuses on a much smaller scale, it tells me that when it comes to drinking your mom probably did an awful lot of it while you were still in the womb.
Well Rob agree with all you just posted! At least there’s a few of us ( not marching in the streets) but wielding the pen that is mightier than the sword. Advocate for Peace, continue to speak out, while we still can.
Last I saw, it is Russian territory because you annexed it last week after your bogus referendums!
Oops.
Stop drinking and update the talking points, Yuri! Or maybe you lost track because you keep losing ground?
And America's biggest problem is it tries to civilize savages and doesn't commit enough war crimes. The Iraqis and Afghans were totally defeated on the battlefield. What needed to happen in the occupation was an ethnic cleansing of Pashtun and Sunnis.
You Drunks -- sorry Russians -- tried that in Ukraine ... and got the locals so mad they're chasing you to the gates of Moscow.
Better drink up, son.
Those Ukes seem mad and they'll probably want a crack at your wife before they burn your apartment.
Okay, that clinches it. Either you're a paid troll who doesn't believe what he's typing, or you're a genocide advocate. Whichever it is, it's clear that you don't give a shit about human life.
Against my better judgment, I'll bite: what the hell is a "Dim" anyway? It's obvious you're not talking about Democrats, a.k.a. "the other Republicans".
I think by now that the question isn't how we maintain a society like that, but how we get it BACK to being that way. Assuming that it ever was in the first place.
In The Decline of the West, Spengler says what you're thinking:
"The Press today is an army with carefully organized arms and branches, with journalists as officers, and readers as soldiers. But here, as in every army, the soldier obeys blindly, and war-aims and operation-plans change without his knowledge. The reader neither knows, nor is allowed to know, the purposes for which he is used, nor even the role that he is to play. A more appalling caricature of freedom of thought cannot be imagined. Formerly a man did not dare to think freely. Now he dares, but cannot."
Not only is there no peace movement any more without any movie stars, but all the movie stars are pro-war now. Take Mark Hamill: he has gone from supporting peace candidate George McGovern back when George McGovern ran for president in the '70s...to today cheerleading the Ukrainian (and apparently also American) forces that Russia is fighting, and comparing Russia to the Empire. It's infuriating if you don't know that Hamill used to be much better than this, and infuriating but also sad if you do.
"...no peace movement any more without any movie stars..."
I'm not looking a gift horse in the mouth. Why should anyone pay attention to the political opinions of a bunch of actors whose life circumstances are radically different from most of ours? They just cheapen what they tout. Hey, i supported Bernie too, but i don't give a shit that Susan Sarandon did. I 'm not going to vote for any candidate, or even vote at all, on the endorsement of some actor.
I agree that we shouldn’t be looking for guidance from narcissistic nutter celebs…what’s interesting tho, is the cultural shift away from advocating for and loving peace, to the total glorification and romanticization of violence. A harbinger of dark times.
I suppose you have a point that people shouldn't form or change their opinions on various issues just because somebody in the entertainment business tells them to.
But I wish that they would either not say anything at all or be on the right side. As someone who grew up with the original Star Wars trilogy, it honestly stings to see Hamill not just have the wrong opinion on Ukraine, but echo the shitlib position time after time after time. He even went so far as to praise Neera Tanden once. The more he does it, the more difficult it is to put out of my mind when I watch one of the films, and if I can't put it out of my mind then I can't enjoy something that I've enjoyed for more than half my life.
What's the right side though? I'm the anti-war voter, not a popular position these days. Good luck finding a shitlib or old school Republican sleb who agrees with that, they're too busy disaster touring the Ukraine. Using the Oscars as a political soapbox has a long history now, probably why they've been unwatchable for a long time.
The thing that irritates me most are the ones who are always bleating at us to vote. If i'm going to vote, i'm going to vote, and if i'm not, i'm not. And if i do, it's going to be for who i think best (that would be third party / indy these days). I can't imagine why some very basic dude who happened to be born to foreign royalty who has never voted in his life and his missus wouyld change my mind.
I hear ya about what it's like being anti-war these days. You're surrounded by people who've swallowed all the pro-war propaganda, with the current propaganda often coming from the very same people who sold the Iraq invasion to the public in the early 2000s.
One would hope that this would make the public skeptical. But they've either memory-holed the Bush years (for those who lived through them) or they don't even remember Iraq because they're too young. So much for that hope.
At least when it was Iraq, everyone eventually realized that there weren't any WMD after all. Only took a few years for most of them. With this current wave, if we count RussiaGate as the start of it, it's now six years and counting, and nobody who believed the lies has realized they were lies yet.
This means that I've got to listen to people regurgitate that propaganda wherever I go, and I either have to bite my tongue as I get more and more pissed off, or say something and wind up in an argument with like a half-dozen people.
I'm a little surprised about your confusion and consternation over the NY Times over the assassination of the Russian nationalist philosopher's daughter, particularly the consternation that the Ukraine is filled with factions acting independently of each other. When this war began, I made a concerted effort to know what's been going on in Ukraine especially since 2014. There are not only plenty of both mainstream (pre- the current self-censorship period) and independent news articles, lectures by Prof. Steven Cohen and lots of YouTube videos by both establishment and independent news, etc.
What's clear from that research we installed a coalition of right-wing nationalists in the 2014 coup where the Neo-Nazi militias were both a part of the government yet separate from it; that those groups were the violent muscle behind the coup; that at least one political assassination happened within Ukraine (I think it was 2018) and these groups had made threats to various politicians when they've made indications of considering compromise with the Russians; that the militias were formally integrated into the Ukrainian army which had before that had a problem with desertion and after that, fear and intimidation clearly must have changed the situation.
Most recently, you saw Zelensky touring a recently re-captured town and behind was a heavily armed person where you could make out the SS patch on his arm. Was that man literally part of Zelensky's security detail or a high ranking person in the army counter-offensive? Unclear, but Zelensky removed his social media post after the revelation that there was a Neo-Nazi in close physical proximity to the President.
There is also the interesting situation where Zelensky tried to fire two of his intelligence officers a couple of months ago, but there was immediate push-back to that so it wasn't clear that they stayed fired. While there is a certain amount of tea leaf reading here, it's obvious to me that factions exist in the Ukrainian and that the factions with the guns always have the real power. So, the article is simply, perhaps unintentionally, telling the truth that we've opened Pandora's Box and like Pandora have completely lost control of the evils we've released.
I'm on that same train of thought. The bombing of the Bridge, the shelling of the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Plant, the assassination of Dugina, and now Zelensky calling for pre-emptive nuclear strike on Russia has the Ukraine becoming a costly liability very quickly, especially is one considers the massive self-inflicted economic damage done by the sanctions and growing unrest in Western Europe. No one in the West really gives a crap about Ukraine, or they would have been pushing for a settlement. The Warmongers in NATO wanted to piss off Russia and how many Ukrainians are killed doing it doesn't matter much. However, the threat of going Nuclear may have just raised the ante to higher than they are willing to pay. If that is the case, Zelensky gets thrown under the bus,
Question for Kirn: If you won’t learn if the girlfriend’s phone conversation will last at least thirty minutes until thirty minutes have passed, how will you know to ignore the first twenty?
It really pays off to be a religious believer right now. I know for a fact the world is not going to end anytime soon. But I derive that knowledge from faith, not from the fact that Joe Biden is in charge.
the NYT is starting to read like China’s “people’s daily”. It’s well known that the Chinese “Ministry of Culture” sends a daily fax/email to all China papers that instructs editors on what they should or shouldn’t cover. Our government might be less heavy handed but it seems like we’re following their example?
Propaganda in the 21st century is a complex game of Go that few but the practioners themselve can understand. I think stepping back and seeing this all through a lense of impartial history is the best way to understand what is happenning in Ukraine. The following video presentation helped me grasp the situation clearly:
NYT story—USA distances itself from actions taken by other actors on a USA sponsored kill list. Maybe they don't want blowback if anything happened to any US or UK citizens on that list. Roger Waters did cancel a planned concert in Poland.
Ambassador de Sadesky: The deciding factor [in creating the doomsday machine] was when we learned that your country was working along similar lines, and we were afraid of a doomsday gap.
President Muffley: This is preposterous! I never approved of anything like that!
Ambassador de Sadesky: Our source was The New York Times.
You're treating The NY Times like a news agency and it's not.
For years, it's been Pravda for the Dim Party; a way for the inner party to communicate the new party line, for the outer party to reconcile the contradictions, and the general membership to get its two minutes of hate.
That it's now functioning as a way to send messages to foreign adversaries is no surprise. That's exactly what Pravda did for the Soviet Communist Party; put it in black and white so even the Ivy League incompetents at the CIA can't miss it.
The NY Times is the definition of fake news; nothing in it is an attempt to genuinely inform the public. Hasn't been for at least 15 years.
Some of us didn’t realize it until they went full TDS. But once you see how they calibrate the party line, it can’t be unseen.
I admit, I had the blinders until Hussein Obama.
When I saw how the media pushed a mediocrity of no discernible achievement like that only because of his black face, then I saw it.
My bad.
It really is. I still haven't read the piece, but if as Matt and Walt say, that piece isn't for us, but for Putin, then that's as cut and dried a case of direct stenography as you'll find. No reporting involved.
You're right.
They should be embarrassed.
But no one at The NY Times knows what journalism is, so they're not.
How am I treating the NYTs? Did I even use the NYT anywhere? Do you even know who you are answering?
THE TREASONOUS PROPAGANDA OF THE NEW YORK TIMES
In late August, 1619, 20-30 enslaved Africans landed at Point Comfort, today's Fort Monroe in Hampton, Va., aboard the English privateer ship White Lion. In Virginia, these Africans were traded in exchange for supplies. The 1619 Project claims that this event was the true founding of America, even though the slavers were clearly British privateers. They claim that this lead to “Systemic Racism” in the United States regardless of the stated principles of human liberty in the declaration of independence.
And this 1619 Project paper; The 1619 Project: A New Origin Story by Nikole Hannah-Jones published and promoted by the NYTimes won a Pulitzer Prize for Commentary!! This is fake history to claim this as America’s origin story. The origin of the United States of America was in 1776 with the publishing of the Declaration of Independence.
And then there is another story in the NYTimes: The Constitution Is Broken and Should Not Be Reclaimed (Aug. 19, 2022). By Ryan D. Doerfler and Samuel Moyn
THE TREASONOUS PROPAGANDA OF THE NEW YORK TIMES
Ryan D. Doerfler of Harvard and Samuel Moyn of Yale are law professors.
_________________________________________________________________
"Keeping Faith with the Constitution" is a new publication of the American Constitution Society that presents a compelling and common-sense approach to constitutional interpretation – one that is faithful to the Constitution’s words and principles and that explains why it is the world’s most enduring written constitution. The book, authored by scholars Goodwin Liu, Pamela S. Karlan, and Christopher H. Schroeder, examines the text and history of the Constitution to show how the Framers inscribed the fundamental values of liberty, equality, and democracy into the document. It then describes and defends an approach to interpreting the Constitution the authors call “constitutional fidelity,” which, as the Framers envisioned, applies the Constitution’s broad principles to the changing needs, conditions, and understandings of our society. This dynamic process of constitutional interpretation, the book shows, has brought about the greatest legal achievements in our history, has allowed us to meet new challenges and unforeseen circumstances, and has enabled each generation of Americans to keep faith with the Constitution.
Keeping Faith with the Constitution | ACS
Keeping Faith with the Constitution Author(s): Pamela S. Karlan, Goodwin Liu & Christopher H. Schroeder " Keeping Faith " examines the text and history of the Constitution to show how the Framers inscribed the fundamental values of liberty, equality and democracy into the document. The authors describe what they call "constitutional fidelity," a principle that "serves not only to preserve the Constitution's meaning over time, but also to maintain its authority and legitimacy. The words and principles of the Constitution endure as our fundamental law because they have been made relevant to the conditions and challenges of each generation through an ongoing process of interpretation." By considering constitutional interpretation through history, the authors show that their approach has enabled our nation's greatest advances, from Brown v. Board of Education to women's rights, free speech, the Miranda decision, and the New Deal, emphasizing that our Constitution "reflects, in a spare outline, the moral trajectory of a nation continually striving for greater justice." Oxford University Press released an updated version of "Keeping Faith" as part of its acclaimed Inalienable Rights series in 2010. Download entire book It Is a Constitution We Are Expounding: Collected Writings on Interpreting Our Founding Document Along with Keeping Faith With the Constitution , ACS also has published a companion volume, entitled " It Is a Constitution We Are Expounding: Collected Writings on Interpreting Our Founding Document ." This book, with a Foreword by Professor Laurence H. Tribe , contains excerpts from some of the finest existing writing on methods of constitutional interpretation, taken from decisions of the Supreme Court and other opinions and speeches by Justices and judges, the scholarly literature, and other sources. The materials gathered in this volume explore a variety of interpretive resources that can help illuminate the Constitution’s meaning, including its text, structure, and history, the shared values it embodies, judicial precedent, and the consequences a particular interpretation is likely to have. Like Keeping Faith – whose authors drew upon many of the ideas presented in this volume – this publication presents "accepted tools of interpretation; that are faithful to the Constitution. Download It is a Constitution We Are Expounding: Collected Writings on Interpreting Our Founding Document Both books are designed to be useful to a wide readership, including law students, lawyers, judges, and every citizen engaged in the nation’s debates over the Constitution, the courts, and judicial nominations. Read more here . Keeping Faith Fact Sheet and FAQs "Keeping Faith with the Constitution" is a new publication of the American Constitution Society that presents a compelling and common-sense approach to constitutional interpretation – one that is faithful to the Constitution’s words and principles and that explains why it is the world’s most enduring wr
https://www.acslaw.org/book/keeping-faith-with-the-constitution/#:~:text=
This is clearly the more rational and reasonable argument of the two considering it does not outright call for eliminating constitutional law from the republic.
The question becomes; why has the “Gray Lady” the estimable New York Times lobby for the elimination of 1776 as the date of America’s founding, and why does it now lobby for elimination the U.S. Constitution? Could it be that us conservative commentators have been correct in asserting that the NYTimes is a Neo-Marxist Uber-Liberal radical rag propagating revolution against the American republic? How could any reasonable person doubt it?
Joe Biden Gives The Most Dangerous Presidential Speech In Modern History:
https://youtu.be/N7jgQctp8rU?t=23
\\][//
Anyone else worried the U of A is going to pull some crazy false flag shenanigans in order to spur an official war declaration? Worked so well a decade ago…
Hi Emily - you may be over the target. In my youth I read with outrage about North Vietnam's unprovoked attack on a US warship in the Gulf of Tonkin, only to find out many years later that this was a "false flag". Given this event was the pretext for fully engaging in what came to be known as the Vietnam War, this was a big deal. We should pray this does not happen again.
Also - note the irony. I read about both versions of the event in the same newspapers. It was just that the conflicting versions were separated by a number of years.
It was then that people started to look back and focus on Pearl Harbor and Iraq. Was 9/11 started with a False Flag (Twin Towers). Today there are still people who think the US knew about it. It was the Israelis who were famous for false flags.
FBI report "Israelis Dancing" about a white truck parked in an apartment building parking lot from early in the morning. Watching the Twin Towers and taking their pictures of each other ON top of that van with the Towers in the back ground. When the planes hit, they began wildly dancing and celebrating in the parking lot.
https://wearechange.org/the-dancing-israelis-fbi-docs-shed-light-on-apparent-mossad-foreknowledge-of-9-11-attacks/
And the "Levon Affair" Israel, 52 Years Ago, the US Covered Up an Israeli False Flag Attack that Killed 34 Americans, Wounded 173.
Israelis have another game called "Big Dog Little Dog". Where Israel bombs, example, Iran and hides behind the US. They start our wars for US.
It was so obviously a controlled demolition. When they got away with that and installed the patriot act, we became a national security state. The old USA died that day. You are no longer allowed to know what your government does
I love Grape Soda. ENRON SEC Evidence was in Building # 7 along with all those other cases. Never heard again about ENRON , did ya?
A near certainty in my book. The only question is, will it have the desired effects, one of which has to be convincing the young to march to slaughter
Good question. I think it’s entirely possible, but it would take something scary, followed by the usual propaganda BS you’re guaranteed from most mainstream media.
This thread is a mess, so sorry if I missed your point.
You think American troops are going to Ukraine in large numbers?
False flag to get the rah rah going for war. It’s worked before. Will it this time? I’m doubtful. What I don’t doubt is there will be plenty of confusion.
Seems as though the false flag has already started. First blowup a pipeline then a bridge ( in Crimea)! Putin has amazing patience in part due to his discipline in martial arts. Learned this from watching 3 part series by Oliver Stone interviewing Putin. Good luck finding it now.
I'd like to hear an explanation from your fevered brain why "patient and peaceful Putin" invaded Ukraine in the most naked agression since Hitler marched into the Sudetland?
You probably don't care because you get the roubles, but do you know you hurt your country with these bad propaganda posts?
They make Russia even more laughable than it's bad battlefield performance.
I sort of wondered whether the Nord Stream explosions were done partly as a false flag. I know that the main thing the US would get out of doing it would be a Russia incapable of supplying gas to Europe/threatening to turn the gas off if Europe crossed them, and a desperate Europe having no choice but to buy American gas exports instead. But with American insistence that Russia did this on purpose, they get to say "OMG, look at how cruel Vladimir Putin is! He's ensuring Europeans will freeze this winter, and he's even destroyed the means to get gas to them again if he changes his mind! Clearly, this man is evil and we have to remove him from power by any means necessary!"
Or, the same leader who invaded Ukraine and thought he would swallow it within a week, thought he'd teach those Germans a lesson by blowing them up.
You must admit, Puty's proven he's about as good a strategist as Saddam Hussein.
🤣
You know, it's not easy to surprise me if you're part of Blue MAGA, but implying that you believe invading Iraq was justified? Yeah, that surprises me.
What doesn't surprise me is that you look at a war which was the equivalent of Mike Tyson in his prime fighting a toddler, and you're dumb enough to chalk up Saddam losing to bad strategy.
I shed no tears when dictators like Saddam or Puty die. And I shed none for their people who tolerate them when they die.
Like Puty, Saddam thought he was Mohammed Ali in his prime.
That's almost as bad a strategy as anyone paying you to post.
😂
I'm more worried you Russian trolls are going to drink yourselves to death in despair over how badly your army has been beaten.
That’s a grim life you must lead, wishing a horrible fate upon a person, and revealing insane bloodlust at the same time. Put your phone down and go for a walk. Maybe listen to some nice Tchaikovsky? 😂
PS: not wanting to go to war doesn’t make you a troll. Although let’s hope more people are enlightened enough to realize this. I have my doubts.
Do you even read the comment or just copy and paste the same response?
You get the roubles either way, amirite? 😂
Tchaikovsky would be embarrassed by today's Russia ... and his Russia was embarrassing enough. 😂
You got nothing and it shows
Lol, last I saw it wasn't RUSSIAN territory getting annexed.
Anyway, if America and its allies getting away with war crimes was going to send me into an alcoholic tailspin, then I would have been drinking a fifth every day starting in 2003 and continuing for however long it would take for me to actually die as I saw stories about regime change in Libya, about attempted regime change in Syria reducing much of the country to rubble and human entrails, about Obama's (and then Trump's, and then Biden's) drone war blowing up weddings and innocent families because according to Michael Hayden they kill people based on metadata, about all the countries we're sanctioning and US officials probably agreeing with the late and unlamented Madeleine Albright when she said that killing hundreds of thousands of children via sanctions was always "worth it", etc.
When dipshits like you are happy to ignore ALL of that and only get upset (or pretend to be upset if you're getting paid to argue in bad faith that America is angelic and pure) when some other country slaughters people or commits human rights abuses on a much smaller scale, it tells me that when it comes to drinking your mom probably did an awful lot of it while you were still in the womb.
Well Rob agree with all you just posted! At least there’s a few of us ( not marching in the streets) but wielding the pen that is mightier than the sword. Advocate for Peace, continue to speak out, while we still can.
Lol
Last I saw, it is Russian territory because you annexed it last week after your bogus referendums!
Oops.
Stop drinking and update the talking points, Yuri! Or maybe you lost track because you keep losing ground?
And America's biggest problem is it tries to civilize savages and doesn't commit enough war crimes. The Iraqis and Afghans were totally defeated on the battlefield. What needed to happen in the occupation was an ethnic cleansing of Pashtun and Sunnis.
You Drunks -- sorry Russians -- tried that in Ukraine ... and got the locals so mad they're chasing you to the gates of Moscow.
Better drink up, son.
Those Ukes seem mad and they'll probably want a crack at your wife before they burn your apartment.
😂
Okay, that clinches it. Either you're a paid troll who doesn't believe what he's typing, or you're a genocide advocate. Whichever it is, it's clear that you don't give a shit about human life.
I grew up I the seventies, son. When Russians and Dims die, it's a good day.
Now get running, Yuri. Zelensky is coming. And he just might decide to chain you to his porch next to Puty.
😂
Against my better judgment, I'll bite: what the hell is a "Dim" anyway? It's obvious you're not talking about Democrats, a.k.a. "the other Republicans".
This is all so uncomfortable. How do we maintain a moral, ethical and civil society when there is no truth, but only power and manipulation?
As they say, play soccer with your kids.
I think by now that the question isn't how we maintain a society like that, but how we get it BACK to being that way. Assuming that it ever was in the first place.
In The Decline of the West, Spengler says what you're thinking:
"The Press today is an army with carefully organized arms and branches, with journalists as officers, and readers as soldiers. But here, as in every army, the soldier obeys blindly, and war-aims and operation-plans change without his knowledge. The reader neither knows, nor is allowed to know, the purposes for which he is used, nor even the role that he is to play. A more appalling caricature of freedom of thought cannot be imagined. Formerly a man did not dare to think freely. Now he dares, but cannot."
Thank you for a sane post
Vietnam was never a declared war. Officially, the US only sent military advisers. On Christmas 1967, there were half a million of them
Congress abdicated it’s duties. It let the executive wage war
The NYT is an irredeemable shitrag. Has been ever since 2001.
Not only is there no peace movement any more without any movie stars, but all the movie stars are pro-war now. Take Mark Hamill: he has gone from supporting peace candidate George McGovern back when George McGovern ran for president in the '70s...to today cheerleading the Ukrainian (and apparently also American) forces that Russia is fighting, and comparing Russia to the Empire. It's infuriating if you don't know that Hamill used to be much better than this, and infuriating but also sad if you do.
"...no peace movement any more without any movie stars..."
I'm not looking a gift horse in the mouth. Why should anyone pay attention to the political opinions of a bunch of actors whose life circumstances are radically different from most of ours? They just cheapen what they tout. Hey, i supported Bernie too, but i don't give a shit that Susan Sarandon did. I 'm not going to vote for any candidate, or even vote at all, on the endorsement of some actor.
I agree that we shouldn’t be looking for guidance from narcissistic nutter celebs…what’s interesting tho, is the cultural shift away from advocating for and loving peace, to the total glorification and romanticization of violence. A harbinger of dark times.
I suppose you have a point that people shouldn't form or change their opinions on various issues just because somebody in the entertainment business tells them to.
But I wish that they would either not say anything at all or be on the right side. As someone who grew up with the original Star Wars trilogy, it honestly stings to see Hamill not just have the wrong opinion on Ukraine, but echo the shitlib position time after time after time. He even went so far as to praise Neera Tanden once. The more he does it, the more difficult it is to put out of my mind when I watch one of the films, and if I can't put it out of my mind then I can't enjoy something that I've enjoyed for more than half my life.
What's the right side though? I'm the anti-war voter, not a popular position these days. Good luck finding a shitlib or old school Republican sleb who agrees with that, they're too busy disaster touring the Ukraine. Using the Oscars as a political soapbox has a long history now, probably why they've been unwatchable for a long time.
The thing that irritates me most are the ones who are always bleating at us to vote. If i'm going to vote, i'm going to vote, and if i'm not, i'm not. And if i do, it's going to be for who i think best (that would be third party / indy these days). I can't imagine why some very basic dude who happened to be born to foreign royalty who has never voted in his life and his missus wouyld change my mind.
I hear ya about what it's like being anti-war these days. You're surrounded by people who've swallowed all the pro-war propaganda, with the current propaganda often coming from the very same people who sold the Iraq invasion to the public in the early 2000s.
One would hope that this would make the public skeptical. But they've either memory-holed the Bush years (for those who lived through them) or they don't even remember Iraq because they're too young. So much for that hope.
At least when it was Iraq, everyone eventually realized that there weren't any WMD after all. Only took a few years for most of them. With this current wave, if we count RussiaGate as the start of it, it's now six years and counting, and nobody who believed the lies has realized they were lies yet.
This means that I've got to listen to people regurgitate that propaganda wherever I go, and I either have to bite my tongue as I get more and more pissed off, or say something and wind up in an argument with like a half-dozen people.
It's fucking lonely and exhausting.
Amen, brother.
Right there with you guys.
Yes it is
I'm a little surprised about your confusion and consternation over the NY Times over the assassination of the Russian nationalist philosopher's daughter, particularly the consternation that the Ukraine is filled with factions acting independently of each other. When this war began, I made a concerted effort to know what's been going on in Ukraine especially since 2014. There are not only plenty of both mainstream (pre- the current self-censorship period) and independent news articles, lectures by Prof. Steven Cohen and lots of YouTube videos by both establishment and independent news, etc.
What's clear from that research we installed a coalition of right-wing nationalists in the 2014 coup where the Neo-Nazi militias were both a part of the government yet separate from it; that those groups were the violent muscle behind the coup; that at least one political assassination happened within Ukraine (I think it was 2018) and these groups had made threats to various politicians when they've made indications of considering compromise with the Russians; that the militias were formally integrated into the Ukrainian army which had before that had a problem with desertion and after that, fear and intimidation clearly must have changed the situation.
Most recently, you saw Zelensky touring a recently re-captured town and behind was a heavily armed person where you could make out the SS patch on his arm. Was that man literally part of Zelensky's security detail or a high ranking person in the army counter-offensive? Unclear, but Zelensky removed his social media post after the revelation that there was a Neo-Nazi in close physical proximity to the President.
There is also the interesting situation where Zelensky tried to fire two of his intelligence officers a couple of months ago, but there was immediate push-back to that so it wasn't clear that they stayed fired. While there is a certain amount of tea leaf reading here, it's obvious to me that factions exist in the Ukrainian and that the factions with the guns always have the real power. So, the article is simply, perhaps unintentionally, telling the truth that we've opened Pandora's Box and like Pandora have completely lost control of the evils we've released.
I'm on that same train of thought. The bombing of the Bridge, the shelling of the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Plant, the assassination of Dugina, and now Zelensky calling for pre-emptive nuclear strike on Russia has the Ukraine becoming a costly liability very quickly, especially is one considers the massive self-inflicted economic damage done by the sanctions and growing unrest in Western Europe. No one in the West really gives a crap about Ukraine, or they would have been pushing for a settlement. The Warmongers in NATO wanted to piss off Russia and how many Ukrainians are killed doing it doesn't matter much. However, the threat of going Nuclear may have just raised the ante to higher than they are willing to pay. If that is the case, Zelensky gets thrown under the bus,
Question for Kirn: If you won’t learn if the girlfriend’s phone conversation will last at least thirty minutes until thirty minutes have passed, how will you know to ignore the first twenty?
It really pays off to be a religious believer right now. I know for a fact the world is not going to end anytime soon. But I derive that knowledge from faith, not from the fact that Joe Biden is in charge.
the NYT is starting to read like China’s “people’s daily”. It’s well known that the Chinese “Ministry of Culture” sends a daily fax/email to all China papers that instructs editors on what they should or shouldn’t cover. Our government might be less heavy handed but it seems like we’re following their example?
Propaganda in the 21st century is a complex game of Go that few but the practioners themselve can understand. I think stepping back and seeing this all through a lense of impartial history is the best way to understand what is happenning in Ukraine. The following video presentation helped me grasp the situation clearly:
https://youtu.be/JrMiSQAGOS4?t=19 - Why Ukraine is the West's Fault - Featuring John Mearsheimer
\\][//
NYT story—USA distances itself from actions taken by other actors on a USA sponsored kill list. Maybe they don't want blowback if anything happened to any US or UK citizens on that list. Roger Waters did cancel a planned concert in Poland.
You are correct. However “according to anonymous sources” means little more than gossip to me.
Always and everywhere propaganda unless it hurts someone powerful as in true whistle blowing
New York times is the new pravda
From the movie "Dr. Strangelove:"
Ambassador de Sadesky: The deciding factor [in creating the doomsday machine] was when we learned that your country was working along similar lines, and we were afraid of a doomsday gap.
President Muffley: This is preposterous! I never approved of anything like that!
Ambassador de Sadesky: Our source was The New York Times.