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Brent Nyitray's avatar

I refer to the "left" as the Democrats, liberals, neocons, the mainstream media, the identity politic groups, the administrative state, collectivists and the cultural left.

I know that term triggers a lot of people, but the differences between Sanders leftists and liberals is not big enough IMO to distinguish.

Bottom line, "democrats" and "liberals" do not represent the breadth that is the Borg. And the Borg needs a name. It has been named "the left"

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Solidarities's avatar

This is an inaccurate usage of the left. It groups Matt Taibi & Glenn Greenwald in with Biden & neocons. "The left" does not mean "everyone I don't like."

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Brent Nyitray's avatar

I understand. But Matt and Glenn share most of the same philosophies of Biden and the neocons re social issues, government spending priorities and tax policy. They are more similar than they are different.

And ultimately, that is the bucket they are put in. I know left-lefties have issues, and the term is not perfect, but it is the name the Borg has been given.

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Sevender's avatar

No. Shockingly, you don’t get to dictate to other people what they believe. Cruelly unfair, I know.

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Brent Nyitray's avatar

I didn't decree this. It is what how outsiders refer to the Borg.

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Solidarities's avatar

No, neocons have different views on those issues. Neocons want lots of military spending & wars, for instance.

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Brent Nyitray's avatar

Max Boot or Jen Rubin are garden-variety democrats who supported the Iraq war.

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Ken's avatar

I saw Max Boot at a Los Angeles book fair at the time of the Iraq War. He was booed off the stage. He is not left.

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Brent Nyitray's avatar

I am just going by what he currently writes at the Washington Post. He is no different than E.J. Dionne or Greg Sargent.

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Solidarities's avatar

Max Boot is not a leftist. Leftists find his views repulsive. The Democratic party is not a leftist party. Leftists tried to take it over and failed. The critiques of the Democrats put out by Greenwald & Taibi are leftist critiques. Every time you agree with either you are agreeing with a leftist.

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Brent Nyitray's avatar

True leftists won't agree with this name. Political scientists won't either. But that is how you have been grouped and named.

If it makes you feel any better I am a libertarian who gets lumped in with Evangelists and Republicans.

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Kelby's avatar

“I understand.” *Proceeds to not understand at all*

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Brent Nyitray's avatar

I understand your objections. I don't find them persuasive. Is that more clear?

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Kelby's avatar

So you don’t find the leftist objection on being lumped in with folks like Biden persuasive? Why not? It’s very clear to me, anyway, that folks like Biden and Sanders are coming from very different places and have totally different objectives.

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Brent Nyitray's avatar

Because there are basically two tribes. The left, which i described above which is the hegemon, and the right which includes Republicans, libertarians, religious types, free market people, and just normies who can't stand what the left has become.

The left left is included in the left. It sure doesn't fit in with Libertarians and Christians.

If you had to divide the two groups up by an ideology, I would say it probably cleaves along the concept of inequality. If inequality REALLY bothers you, then you are a leftie

If it doesn't, then you are a rightie.

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Kelby's avatar

The libertarian right and the “left left” have more in common than you might imagine. Frankly, the only thing that separates anarchists from the staunchest libertarians is that libertarians believe in private property.

Boiling political complexities down into two tribes is not helpful and is part of the reason why we are in the position we find ourselves in. It invites polarization and conflict. Reality is much more nuanced than what you’re getting at here, and talking about those nuances without giving into the temptation of making it an us vs. them thing is the only way we’re going to get dialogue going among all the camps.

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Brent Nyitray's avatar

There is no dialogue between left and right. Left lectures, right ignores.

But ultimately I think the left is onboard the successor ideology and they are going to run with it. All I can do is stay the fuck away from these people.

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Kelby's avatar

Your stance is as disappointing as it is unsurprising.

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