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Matt330's avatar

I have found you can get through to many people who have become immersed in doublethink. The trick is have a good memory, command of the facts, and apply gentle but constant pressure. You need to be able to make people remember what people said in the past, the reasons they gave for saying it, and be able to compare that with what they are saying now. The good news is I find this has started to become easier than ever. The shameless government and media lying has got to the point where even disengaged and politically apathetic Americans are skeptical about what they see or hear. What you need to do is remind them of why they were skeptical when their skepticism starts to fade and break down the emotional manipulation they are undergoing. The Iraq War and Covid-19 are very effective in this regard. Things may seem worse than ever (and they might be), but we also have an opportunity we cannot miss.

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jason holland's avatar

Unfortunately I disagree. People are so invested in their group think that any heresy is immediately tuned out. Once you challenge someone core beliefs their human reaction to not hear it is too great. Even though I am a devout believer I still understand the contradiction of belief, but most people can not do that. Our thought tribalism is so ingrained now in our collective psyche that to waver from the truth causes mental shit down.

I don’t agree with cutting off news from either side. If we are not able to talk to each other through news we will cause more lasting harm. Unfortunately we may have already crossed that Rubicon and there is not going back

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Matt330's avatar

I'm talking about normal people in the real world, not twitter obsessed dipshits.

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Bill Viall's avatar

I admire your optimism Matt, but respectfully disagree. The telescreen, running on fear, lack of meaning & isolation are insanely potent tools for mass control. Obviously I’m plagiarizing Mathias Desmet—whom I greatly admire. He shares your belief, that we can move the gulled, but I’m just stupefied by the extent of hypnosis of otherwise intelligent people who should know better.

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Kimchi Jong il's avatar

Evolution hates prolonged periods of peace and development, it needs strife and warfare to function properly.

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baker charlie's avatar

I'd certainly like to try to have a long enough period of peace and development to find out if that is true...

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Mike R.'s avatar

Tyrants need strife and warfare to justify their theft.

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lucrezia's avatar

If you're "talking about normal people in the real world" then you're excluding 95% of the commenters here also.

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Mar 14, 2022
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jason holland's avatar

Meant “shut” but was on my phone but still funny :)

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Sevender's avatar

It helps to start with a contentious issue that isn’t the matter at hand. Believe it or not International Women’s Day has sparked some conversations about how the truth is often the exact opposite of what we’re told.

Do you remember the movie War Games? Matthew Broderick, 1980s? Before the AI that was about to launch WWIII could learn that it was impossible to win a nuclear war, first it had to learn that unwinnable games existed. So they taught it Tic Tac Toe. Find each person’s Tic Tac Toe and you’re halfway there.

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Phisto Sobanii's avatar

You're right! Know what you're talking about, because they don't. Over time, it works.

Patience is so very underrated.

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Kev's avatar

I agree. It's tough though. I have been doing this for years. You have to go in tiny baby steps otherwise they will shoot the messenger (usually with words, sometimes physical violoence).

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Gordon Freeman's avatar

Really excellent points!

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Mar 13, 2022
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Mar 13, 2022
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Rfhirsch's avatar

I like your last sentence stating that Dems are idiots! Thank you!

In fact Hillary Clinton claimed she won in 2016 for three years, blaming the Russians for getting votes her President Trump.

And there is ample evidence of voter fraud in 2020. The latest data from Wisconsin show that the 91 nursing homes checked each had at least 95% voter turnout, and many 100%, when relatives of many residents testified that their parent or aunt or uncle was incapable of voting, had not voted in more than 10 years, and could not even recognize their own children, et al.

We know that there was massive fraud in Fulton County, Georgia. The person in charge of the vote collecting and tallying stated publicly (for example, on CBS News) that the system would shut down at 1030pm on election day, and reopen the following morning. Surveillance cameras show people coming in at 1130pm, pulling boxes from under tables and opening them and putting the ballots through the vote counting machines.

In Detroit, Republican poll watchers were not allowed in the vote tallying rooms, which the law says they must be allowed to do.

Etc., etc., etc.

And the biggest question is "How did Biden, who everyone agrees was an awful candidate (as was his running mate, Harris), who was not allowed out of his home for most of the campaign, win 81 million votes?"

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BradK (Afuera!)'s avatar

"How did Biden...win 81 million votes?"

Xerox.

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lucrezia's avatar

"...The latest data from Wisconsin"...

..."The person in charge of the vote collecting and tallying..."

who "everyone" agrees..."

"Etc., etc., etc."

Mr. Rfhirsch: Back to your gaming console...

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Dave's avatar

Another thing Democrats and co. did in 2016: poison U.S.-Russia relations via the Russiagate absurdities, making de-escalatory diplomacy politically impossible in the years following, resulting in the present war in Ukraine (it might have been averted with the slightest of concessions!), which might yet go nuclear owing to the continued political impossibility to undertake the slightest diplomacy, all resulting from those reckless actions post-2016. Frankly I wish they would have just tried to overturn the election.

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lucrezia's avatar

That's some flight of fancy you just took...

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Gordon Freeman's avatar

The only false equivalence is between your ears...

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Phisto Sobanii's avatar

Speaking of idiots, what’s your take on their “fortifying” efforts?

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Mar 13, 2022
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Mar 14, 2022
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Phisto Sobanii's avatar

“Undue influence” and “outright fraudulent” is a very fine line to draw. Too fine, I think.

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Mar 14, 2022
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Phisto Sobanii's avatar

So what’s your excuse?

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