Sam Harris has some pretty good takes on why Trump is so bad but a lot of it comes down to just personally hating the guy. Harris :
“ There is never a moment where I find Trump persuasive. When I look at him I see a man without any inner life. I see the most superficial person on Earth. This is a guy who has been totally hollowed out by g…
Sam Harris has some pretty good takes on why Trump is so bad but a lot of it comes down to just personally hating the guy. Harris :
“ There is never a moment where I find Trump persuasive. When I look at him I see a man without any inner life. I see the most superficial person on Earth. This is a guy who has been totally hollowed out by greed and self regard and delusion. If I caught some sort of brain virus and I started talking about myself the way Trump talks about himself, I would throw myself out a fucking window. ”
I used to think Sam Harris was so sophisticated, and yet that quote is so incredibly crude and unsophisticated. Childlike, really.
Yeah, Trump is gross. And narcissistic. And orange. And says really weird shit. He makes me wince.
But this left woke totalitarian movement has been obvious for a while. It kept getting stronger even under Trump. And unless you're a complete fool, it was obvious it would go on steroids if Biden were elected. Which it has.
Poor aesthetics vs. woke dystopia. That was the choice. We chose... poorly.
Trump is buffoonish , but he really did know what was ailing the country, he was just terrible at communicating it, and he had literally nobody to work with in congress.
#Resist started the day after his election. He was never more powerful than the wokeys. The absolute personal hatred toward him from 360 degrees was breathtaking. A guy who had never held office couldn't be helped along for the good of the nation. But then, they weren't very nice to Jimmy Carter either.
Well, I respect the difference of opinion. You must have noticed, though, that the media went into conniptions and predicted cataclysmic disaster after just about everything he did. Didn't that get a little silly?
This sounds like someone possessed by their shadow in the Jungian sense. Meaning he's taken everything he doesn't like about himself and projected it on to someone else. I good sign you're being run by your shadow is if you can't think of a single good thing about the object of your hatred. There was a lot of this in the TDS era.
I think like most replies you misunderstand the question, because it is not just "personally hating the guy", but having an extreme disgust at them.
The question is about *over*-reaction, not just reaction, to Trump. The question to me is about this:
* 4 years of pretty much "normal" right-wing presidency, with some changes in intended policy, and small changes in actual policy, and the over-reaction is "like Hitler" and "democracy itself";
* why the gigantic gap between (overrated) "reality" and disproportionately extreme reactions, both personal and political, to Trump?
But both your reactions are just reactions, and similar reactions could be applied to most politicians, e.g. Hillary Clinton or Ted Cruz, both of which are despised even by many members of their own parties.
I think that the original "so bad" question seems to be about Trump Derangement Syndrome, those “disproportionately extreme reactions, both personal and political”.
Where are the mass graves with the bodies hacked to pieces? Where are the reports of MAGA-hatter death squads "disappearing" Democratic Party activists? Where are the vast torture camps for leftist academics? Where are the photos of the NYT and CNN buildings taken over by the secret police with the journalists brought out in chains?
I believe there were armed, ununiformed goons in unmarked vans scooping people off the street. But I'm not dumb enough to think that couldn't happen under any other president with the right conditions. Still, there's that.
“Italian President Giorgio Napolitano said he had pardoned Colonel Joseph L. Romano, who was the only person not a member of the CIA among 23 Americans sentenced for the kidnapping of Hassan Mustafa Osama Nasr in Milan in 2003. The Egyptian cleric, also known as Abu Omar, was secretly flown to Egypt for interrogation, where he says he was tortured for seven months. He was a resident in Italy at the time of the abduction.”
“Lady and Medero were among 26 Americans convicted for snatching Hassan Mustafa Osama Nasr from a street in Milan in 2003 and whisking him away to be questioned in Egypt.”
Even the english army special forces, not exactly made of "concerned intellectuals", felt that the USA death squads in Iraq were too much:
“Some senior British officers were unhappy at what was going on and the involvement of the UK’s SAS and the SBS. “Why are we helping to run Latin American-style death squads?” One British commander, himself ex-SAS, demanded to know. The SAS were, on at least two occasions, barred from carrying out such missions in the British-run south of the country.
Questions were asked about how information was being obtained from suspects in Balad. There was an unofficial inquiry into the treatment of prisoners at the base, although no evidence was found to implicate Maj Gen McChrystal. ...
But the reverberations from special forces operations in Iraq continued. Six years later Maj Gen McChrystal, by now a four star general and commander of international forces in Afghanistan, had received a complaint from the UK’s director of special forces (DSF) for speaking about operations carried out with the SAS and SBS in Iraq and Afghanistan. Meanwhile an SAS lieutenant colonel, who had served with distinction under Maj Gen McChrystal in Iraq, was told to stay away from the Regiment’s headquarters in Hereford.”
It keeps coming down to this style over substance stuff. I’m tired of it now bc we’re approaching a dangerous situation. I need to hear, from someone intelligent, something Substantive about Trump’s major faults. I’ll go first- he does have an Andrew Jackson complex. He wanted to go down in history.. he wanted ppl to fight for him. This is a very off putting quality for many ppl and it triggered them and scared them. It didn’t come out (IMO) as a truly and Substantively damaging quality until January 6th.
I was disturbed by a couple of things. One was his advocating or condoning violence against political opponents and people he construed to be class enemies, This out of the old-time fascist playbook, although it's possible he didn't understand its connections He also encouraged private-army types. That is one thing I don't want to see catch on in the US. It's not something to fools around with even in humor, as you can find out by reading the history of Germany in the 20th century.
First, he was a true narcissist. And couldn’t control it. He didn’t deliver on his promises because he couldn’t pay attention to them if someone on Hannity was talking about him. He couldn’t listen even to good advice unless someone was sucking him off hard enough.
Second, he had no idea how to address any of the criticisms he had made to find a solution. He governed largely as a standard Republican, even when it hurt him. His lowest ratings came the day his McConnell wet dream tax cut passed.
Third, he sucked as a manager. He picked the worst people for his team. Made working for him completely unappealing to the best people for the job. And dear god did he not always pick the worst legal minds in the business?
Nothing worse than incompetence really. Nowhere near as much of a racist as Joe Biden. Nor as much of a fascist.
but it absolutely doesn't dead-end at style, that's just the low-hanging stinkfruit that most people reach for to throw the most, with good reason. the exact same thing happens with Biden
Well they are really discrediting themselves by going for low hanging fruit. No ones doing the same w Biden - we’re pointing out some very significant and dangerous flaws with him. Where was the Real danger in Trump? So far the only real answer I got is “he turned lefties into fascists and also some ppl don’t like him”. It’s an interesting theory but I’m not buying it that he was a gift created by or given to the Establishment if that lets ppl off the hook for still hating Trump. We’re not going to move forward as a society until we sort out some truth about Trump
The reality that he’s a megalomaniac is not just a matter of style. When anyone who disagrees with you becomes an enemy of the state (because, increasingly, you ARE the state), that’s really a dangerous state of affairs. We may reach fascism by committee with the Dems, but I believe a charismatic megalomaniac can bring that to pass as well.
We are already staring full-on fascism in the face under Democrats (did you READ Matt’s post?), and you’re still pursing your lips and tugging worriedly at your turtleneck over Trump.
I was responding to a post asking what’s so bad about Trump. I did read the article, and I think your response shows you’re bilious and can’t imagine how anyone could reasonably have a different perspective from yours. So fuck off.
To be clear, I have no professional idea of what it means, but I think of Trump as the mega guy, but mostly because, every time he talked, things were "the biggest," "the most," "the greatest," etc.
So, interested to know the forensic analysis of Pres. Obama. This could be a series. But we could be labeled, "misinformation."
Discrediting themselves, no. Not really answering your question, yes. Some have already addressed your question without leaning on style. Indeed, Biden faces (and deserves) similar style attacks, especially from Berniebros, I guess you've only seen the desperate dog jokes.
At one time I was smitten with Harris’ apparent hyper-rationality and ever-so-calm delivery. I don’t know just how it happened, but something destroyed that feeling. One thing that started to bother me was a sense that he wanted to talk about one thing, how bad Islam is, too exclusively. Kinda how I feel about Greenwald sometimes with his anti-mainstream-lib vendetta (not that he’s wrong). Also, both guys get hyper-riled up sometimes when criticized. But whatever.
Harris is nuanced, like the rest of us. I still listen to and respect his opinions on a great many things. Many. Things. His somewhat hyperbolic takes on Covid and Trump I take as interesting counterpoints to other opinions I glean and respect. Long live nuance!
Sam Harris has some pretty good takes on why Trump is so bad but a lot of it comes down to just personally hating the guy. Harris :
“ There is never a moment where I find Trump persuasive. When I look at him I see a man without any inner life. I see the most superficial person on Earth. This is a guy who has been totally hollowed out by greed and self regard and delusion. If I caught some sort of brain virus and I started talking about myself the way Trump talks about himself, I would throw myself out a fucking window. ”
I used to think Sam Harris was so sophisticated, and yet that quote is so incredibly crude and unsophisticated. Childlike, really.
Yeah, Trump is gross. And narcissistic. And orange. And says really weird shit. He makes me wince.
But this left woke totalitarian movement has been obvious for a while. It kept getting stronger even under Trump. And unless you're a complete fool, it was obvious it would go on steroids if Biden were elected. Which it has.
Poor aesthetics vs. woke dystopia. That was the choice. We chose... poorly.
Trump is buffoonish , but he really did know what was ailing the country, he was just terrible at communicating it, and he had literally nobody to work with in congress.
I dunno. I think Trump’s a dangerous man. And at least for awhile there, he was much more powerful than the wokeys.
#Resist started the day after his election. He was never more powerful than the wokeys. The absolute personal hatred toward him from 360 degrees was breathtaking. A guy who had never held office couldn't be helped along for the good of the nation. But then, they weren't very nice to Jimmy Carter either.
They literally said they were going to get him out of office THE DAY AFTER THE ELECTION!
Well, I respect the difference of opinion. You must have noticed, though, that the media went into conniptions and predicted cataclysmic disaster after just about everything he did. Didn't that get a little silly?
This sounds like someone possessed by their shadow in the Jungian sense. Meaning he's taken everything he doesn't like about himself and projected it on to someone else. I good sign you're being run by your shadow is if you can't think of a single good thing about the object of your hatred. There was a lot of this in the TDS era.
Big time
«good takes on why Trump is so bad»
I think like most replies you misunderstand the question, because it is not just "personally hating the guy", but having an extreme disgust at them.
The question is about *over*-reaction, not just reaction, to Trump. The question to me is about this:
* 4 years of pretty much "normal" right-wing presidency, with some changes in intended policy, and small changes in actual policy, and the over-reaction is "like Hitler" and "democracy itself";
* why the gigantic gap between (overrated) "reality" and disproportionately extreme reactions, both personal and political, to Trump?
I’m just torn between “trump is an evil narcissist who has no moral compass and that makes him dangerous” and
“Trump did do some good things he’s just a orange tv star who likes his ego stroked all day. Overall he wasn’t so bad”
But both your reactions are just reactions, and similar reactions could be applied to most politicians, e.g. Hillary Clinton or Ted Cruz, both of which are despised even by many members of their own parties.
I think that the original "so bad" question seems to be about Trump Derangement Syndrome, those “disproportionately extreme reactions, both personal and political”.
Where are the mass graves with the bodies hacked to pieces? Where are the reports of MAGA-hatter death squads "disappearing" Democratic Party activists? Where are the vast torture camps for leftist academics? Where are the photos of the NYT and CNN buildings taken over by the secret police with the journalists brought out in chains?
I believe there were armed, ununiformed goons in unmarked vans scooping people off the street. But I'm not dumb enough to think that couldn't happen under any other president with the right conditions. Still, there's that.
They surely were operating in Italy under GW Bush:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/italy-pardons-us-colonel-cia-rendition-case-flna1B9241457
“Italian President Giorgio Napolitano said he had pardoned Colonel Joseph L. Romano, who was the only person not a member of the CIA among 23 Americans sentenced for the kidnapping of Hassan Mustafa Osama Nasr in Milan in 2003. The Egyptian cleric, also known as Abu Omar, was secretly flown to Egypt for interrogation, where he says he was tortured for seven months. He was a resident in Italy at the time of the abduction.”
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-italy-cia-pardon-idUSKBN0U623J20151223
“Lady and Medero were among 26 Americans convicted for snatching Hassan Mustafa Osama Nasr from a street in Milan in 2003 and whisking him away to be questioned in Egypt.”
Even the english army special forces, not exactly made of "concerned intellectuals", felt that the USA death squads in Iraq were too much:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/chilcot-inquiry-black-ops-in-iraq-caused-split-between-us-and-uk-7130996.html
“Some senior British officers were unhappy at what was going on and the involvement of the UK’s SAS and the SBS. “Why are we helping to run Latin American-style death squads?” One British commander, himself ex-SAS, demanded to know. The SAS were, on at least two occasions, barred from carrying out such missions in the British-run south of the country.
Questions were asked about how information was being obtained from suspects in Balad. There was an unofficial inquiry into the treatment of prisoners at the base, although no evidence was found to implicate Maj Gen McChrystal. ...
But the reverberations from special forces operations in Iraq continued. Six years later Maj Gen McChrystal, by now a four star general and commander of international forces in Afghanistan, had received a complaint from the UK’s director of special forces (DSF) for speaking about operations carried out with the SAS and SBS in Iraq and Afghanistan. Meanwhile an SAS lieutenant colonel, who had served with distinction under Maj Gen McChrystal in Iraq, was told to stay away from the Regiment’s headquarters in Hereford.”
Sam Harris went from being a decent intellectual to completely terminal TDS.
It keeps coming down to this style over substance stuff. I’m tired of it now bc we’re approaching a dangerous situation. I need to hear, from someone intelligent, something Substantive about Trump’s major faults. I’ll go first- he does have an Andrew Jackson complex. He wanted to go down in history.. he wanted ppl to fight for him. This is a very off putting quality for many ppl and it triggered them and scared them. It didn’t come out (IMO) as a truly and Substantively damaging quality until January 6th.
Andrew Jackson if I remember by history was the first and last to successfully disband the central banks, see link.
http://www.campaignforliberty.org/andrew-jackson-and-the-central-bank
I was disturbed by a couple of things. One was his advocating or condoning violence against political opponents and people he construed to be class enemies, This out of the old-time fascist playbook, although it's possible he didn't understand its connections He also encouraged private-army types. That is one thing I don't want to see catch on in the US. It's not something to fools around with even in humor, as you can find out by reading the history of Germany in the 20th century.
First, he was a true narcissist. And couldn’t control it. He didn’t deliver on his promises because he couldn’t pay attention to them if someone on Hannity was talking about him. He couldn’t listen even to good advice unless someone was sucking him off hard enough.
Second, he had no idea how to address any of the criticisms he had made to find a solution. He governed largely as a standard Republican, even when it hurt him. His lowest ratings came the day his McConnell wet dream tax cut passed.
Third, he sucked as a manager. He picked the worst people for his team. Made working for him completely unappealing to the best people for the job. And dear god did he not always pick the worst legal minds in the business?
Nothing worse than incompetence really. Nowhere near as much of a racist as Joe Biden. Nor as much of a fascist.
but it absolutely doesn't dead-end at style, that's just the low-hanging stinkfruit that most people reach for to throw the most, with good reason. the exact same thing happens with Biden
Well they are really discrediting themselves by going for low hanging fruit. No ones doing the same w Biden - we’re pointing out some very significant and dangerous flaws with him. Where was the Real danger in Trump? So far the only real answer I got is “he turned lefties into fascists and also some ppl don’t like him”. It’s an interesting theory but I’m not buying it that he was a gift created by or given to the Establishment if that lets ppl off the hook for still hating Trump. We’re not going to move forward as a society until we sort out some truth about Trump
The reality that he’s a megalomaniac is not just a matter of style. When anyone who disagrees with you becomes an enemy of the state (because, increasingly, you ARE the state), that’s really a dangerous state of affairs. We may reach fascism by committee with the Dems, but I believe a charismatic megalomaniac can bring that to pass as well.
You really shit beige, don’t you?
We are already staring full-on fascism in the face under Democrats (did you READ Matt’s post?), and you’re still pursing your lips and tugging worriedly at your turtleneck over Trump.
I was responding to a post asking what’s so bad about Trump. I did read the article, and I think your response shows you’re bilious and can’t imagine how anyone could reasonably have a different perspective from yours. So fuck off.
wow, what country have you been living in the last 10 years?
To be clear, I have no professional idea of what it means, but I think of Trump as the mega guy, but mostly because, every time he talked, things were "the biggest," "the most," "the greatest," etc.
So, interested to know the forensic analysis of Pres. Obama. This could be a series. But we could be labeled, "misinformation."
Discrediting themselves, no. Not really answering your question, yes. Some have already addressed your question without leaning on style. Indeed, Biden faces (and deserves) similar style attacks, especially from Berniebros, I guess you've only seen the desperate dog jokes.
I've seen the ice cream updates. Bernie bro-ette here, but i suspect we'll let Joe slide and save it for when it's Kamala's Turn.
I used to like Sam Harris but you've totally destroyed that feeling.
At one time I was smitten with Harris’ apparent hyper-rationality and ever-so-calm delivery. I don’t know just how it happened, but something destroyed that feeling. One thing that started to bother me was a sense that he wanted to talk about one thing, how bad Islam is, too exclusively. Kinda how I feel about Greenwald sometimes with his anti-mainstream-lib vendetta (not that he’s wrong). Also, both guys get hyper-riled up sometimes when criticized. But whatever.
Well Islam is a terrible violent religion so I don’t mind that.
Harris is nuanced, like the rest of us. I still listen to and respect his opinions on a great many things. Many. Things. His somewhat hyperbolic takes on Covid and Trump I take as interesting counterpoints to other opinions I glean and respect. Long live nuance!
I've always not been able to stand him.
I’ve always never not hated him
Not a credible source when it comes to Trump. Harris has stage four TDS.