The terrific humorist, journalist, and novelist talks about the downfall of journalism, bureaucratic absurdity, and class cruelty in a blistering indictment of an America turned upside down
Thank you for your hospitality in providing the written transcript along with the podcast. I listened yesterday and thought you and Walter Kirn had a great discussion. I very much agree about the cruelty of assorted pundits and comedians. The pushing of the Overton Window towards punishing the people who don’t go along with the mandates is not a little frightening. I hear the opening credits to Hotel Rwanda in those statements. We are in an unveiling the cruelty in our hearts. I just hope it doesn’t lead to violence, detention camps, the denial of health care coverage—all for a vaccine that doesn’t work, and may well make people sicker.
I very much appreciated your and Walter’s standing up for middle America. We are so not stupid as we are portrayed. We’re the ones who grow the food, truck it across country, repair your toilet, fly your jets.
I think the elites have lost common sense over Covid and the mandates. How is it a good idea to let the Washington state roads stay uncleared because the state refuses to let unvaxxed plow drivers help clear them. How is it healthy to let medical workers testing positive for the virus go to work, while not allowing healthy unvaxxed workers work?
At any rate thank you for your fresh take on our culture and great journalism. (Another subject to research might be the connection between anti depressants and mass shootings. I have heard that those are a common denominator along with guns. And a side effect is homicide and suicide, especially in young people.)
The day when the food truck drivers, the power linemen, the auto mechanics and HVAC repairmen discover that, acting as one, they can bring Hydra Media/Tech/Gov Oligarchy to its knees... well, strap in and pass the popcorn.
Of course it would. We're in this together sisters. That's the biggest tool the ruling classes have; division, by gender is a big one, perhaps the biggest. Just another distraction from the solidarity we need.
Interesting, isn't it, that when you read my generic "mechanics" and "food truck drivers" you immediately assumed I was talking about men? Should I have said "linemen and linewomen"?
When you need something mechanical fixed, how often do women show up to do the work?
I live in Maine so the women are pretty rugged. But, I was responding to your use of linemen and repairmen. Actually I think we all should go on strike regardless of our gender, sex, or job description.
That day will never happen because when the workers realize that everything depends on them will be the end of the parasitic banksters conjuring up money from nothing and controlling us with it. Henry Ford said as much a century ago and we ain't figured out the scams yet.
Here in Illinois when restaurants defied the governor’s orders he yanked their licenses. The health care mandates are causing a shortage of health care workers, along with the infection, so the Feds bring in the National guard to help.
Spot on. We here have been subject to strict measures . Small businesses are fighting for their lives. And a couple weeks ago didn't the Gov discourage elective medical procedures? But, even though we have some of the most repressive pandemic measures, everybody is getting 'effin sick!
I want to believe that it is so ridiculous, that the rabble is going to turn out in huge numbers to go vote in November. I want to believe.
Talk about dreadful. Don’t people worry about what these jabs will do to their immune systems? Covid hasn’t hurt them. Though the response to Covid, shutting down schools has been horrible.
Well the Wall Street Journal just posted an article that maybe masking and social distancing isn’t a good idea with Omicron. That we need to let it do it’s thing, so we don’t get something worse.
I got up this morning and turned on the local news and whether channel. First thing I heard was that some survey said people who wear masks are more attractive. I just shook my head. Propaganda at it worst.
Not even close.This crap biowarfaecgain of function crap was given a thumbs. up in 2002 by … drumroll..W,after missing every screaming warning signa.He was worried about another Al. Qaeda attackSo he anointed Faustus.Remember the Anthrax Mailer? Falsely fingering Dr.Steven Hatfill, his reputation and career destroyed? But “they were mistaken” Let’s pin it on Dr Bruce Ivins and”suicide” him.Case closed. No, the Weaponized Antgeax Mailer was Al Qaeda, cooking it up at Ft Derrick. Another epic fail and cover up.What could go wrong with Mueller.Cofer Black,Brennan,Hayden,Gates,Baker behind the scene?The “ counter terrorism unit”.Al Qaeda had kind been active in the US.Daddy Bush could tell yo ou if his lips weren’t sealed.Clinton could tell you, but he missed the first WTC attack.W could tell you, but he’s a POS.Obama could telll you, but he was busy droning American citizens and arming Al Qaeda. Trump opted for Wray,Haspel,Rosenstein,Barr,McMaster,Mattis,Milley,Faustus,Collins,Redfield,Birx. He was “ advised” by the best.
Instead of opting for the purist,Terry Turchie,who would have brought them alll down
The word "cruelty" is what resonated with me. In today's St. Louis Post-Dispatch front page, "As overdose deaths hit new peak, response from Missouri divided." Since 1/1/20, " . . . nearly 900 accidental fatal overdoses in the city . . . about 200 more deaths than caused by COVID-19." We need more privileged brats on hunger strike at the MLK Memorial. Getting paid $15/hr. Hard to believe.
So often now, I feel I'm being gaslighted by the indoctrinated. I am dumbfounded by what seems to be the stupidity of people who should know better, that, at least at the elite level, there has to be some Machiavellian intent. And that makes me feel that it gives additional validity to those saying it's a coordinated (loosely) conspiracy to implement a One World Order by TPTB are correct.
This system, among other things, rewards people with sociopathic characteristics. So the most powerful are those with the least empathy. I don't think this is controversial these days.
And now that the power is getting more and more concentrated, the sociopaths among us are closer and closer to being able to feed everyone else into the Soylent Green machine.
This covers my annual subscription cost for a year. Awesome, awesome, awesome... and I will tell you why. It gives me hope that professional journalists, professional humorists, professional medical doctors, professional (fill in the blanks) will rise up and start to eliminate the unprofessional jerks within their professional designation that are destroying the brand and reputation of the profession.
The most important one is the profession of science. It is being crushed by the shysters like Fauci.
It is one of the biggest media travesties since the Iraq war, the facts that: it seems likely Fauci had at least some role in funding gain of function research on coronaviruses at Wuhan, the virus overwhelming likely originated from there, he likely lied to Congress about it, definitely was a key part of a conspiracy to dismiss and suppress those facts as unhinged conspiracy theory, and *still* somehow is considered someone with an ounce of credibility. Let alone the godhead of Covid truth.
Not to mention, this is the same Fauci who assured the American public that the Pandemrix vaccine was safe in 2009 in the midst of the swine flu epidemic, and it turned out to be rather not safe. The report is in the British Medical Journal from 2018, but somehow I've only ever seen it refered to once by anyone in the media.
Admit it. Fauci shouldn't be leading the crusade against Covid. Fauci ought to be defending himself against charges of conspiracy to commit murder via his project to develop a highly infectious viral vector. This, to me, is the craziest most unbelievable part of the whole rotten nightmare we are living. The man did it all and not only is he getting away with it, he's LAUGHING AT US.
Cornell West and Ana Kasparian said the same thing. "it's a manufactured culture war." Manufactured to keep conversation away from the topics that led to Bernie and Trump's populism. Namely, Americans are sick of fighting unjustified wars and would prefer that money be spent on a richer welfare state like other first world nations have. For example, parental leave. Americans are also pissed at economic crashes, the lack of decent paying jobs, their justice system, illegal immigration, and the expense of university. Long story short, if you care about these things, you're now standing up for yourself. If you and your partner live in the burbs with good jobs at Microsoft and healthy savings accounts, you selfishly vote to keep everything the same. This isn't tribalism. It's just politics.
The US is different than every other wealthy nation. It's rulers believe their enormous military must continually keep it's knife sharp by always participating in war, and that a first world welfare state is ideologically incorrect. As a result, not all Americans live in the First World. Many live above it and many live below. And, as always, if you wish to improve your situation, one must work / fight (lobby) for it.
As a non-American who's spent much time in your country, I think you have an awful lot of nice people who constantly get jerked around -- and nobody really cares about them. Then again, maybe the aristocracy is right. If you're poor, don't have kids.
I think she is part of the problem Matt and Walter are talking about. A shrill shill working the crowd to induce even more anger. Yes, this one time she may have said something truthful.
It is no accident that wokery, handmaiden of neoliberalism that it is, took off in the wake of the collapse of Occupy Wall Street, the first anti-plutocracy movement to gain any traction with the American public in decades.
Wages may be up, but then 7% inflation kind of makes those gains disappear.
Yes, Biden left Afghanistan, but he's poking the bear to have war with Russia.
Blaming Trump alone for the Drone Strikes, other than the completely stupid attack on Suleimani, is just ridiculous. Obama didn't stop them and Biden didn't stop them.
I live in Billings, MT, and we made the national news a few times for our "overrun" hospital here. (I think Walter Kirn was probably talking about Bozeman as that's more where the writers settle.) Of course, the locals would have told you there are two big hospitals in Billings. One of them was "overrun" and one of them wasn't, and the truth, the locals would have told you, was that the one that was "overrun" was a nightmare before COVID because of staffing shortages and a drive for profit over patient care and that it is frequently "overrun" during flu season. My further frustration is that we desperately need a conversation on our overpriced dangerous joke of a medical system in this country and the fact that it sucks us dry financially and can't even handle a small bump in need. But, no, instead we yell about vaccines and masks and never mention that the other hospital in town, the one that actually takes on indigent cases and therefore is often busier, was holding its own even in the worst of it, and discussing why that was and what we could take from it to improve the system overall. Instead the local newspaper seemed to literally forget that we had two hospitals and turned into a PR team for the one and then the story went national.
We've stopped going after the powerful, started criticizing random, powerless people in Oklahoma or Arkansas, or wherever. Comforting the comfortable and afflicting the afflicted. That's not how it's supposed to work.
Journalism died when print went away with it’s end if day print deadlines. Journalists had time to recheck their facts before the print deadline. The intranet requires no fact checking because the reward ceased to be accuracy and became speed. Who can get the story out first. It is akin to giving a classroom of students the highest grade for finishing a test first, regardless of checking for correct answers. Ridiculous!
Now it's up to the readers to perform the editing and fact-checking function, by putting their information processing into standby mode instead of falling for the first hot take they see or read. Contrary to popular belief, the first person to arrive at a conclusion about a given event or situation is not the smartest one. All too often, they're more like a kid playing with Tinker Toys.
The new media demands a lot more from readers. But it at least carries the potential to be a big improvement.
First of all this bit - "Everybody thinks that because they went to a diner during a presidential primary, that they know the heartbeat of grassroots America."
I was kind of floored by a piece in The Atlantic back in '17 after the election. It was an excellent and eye opening piece, basically about how shellshocked liberals went to the heartland to find out exactly what these deplorables where thinking. The piece centers on the Third Way pollsters, and how the reality of what what they found caused extreme cognitive dissonance with what they expected to find. So they ignored the parts that caused dissonance and wrote up the poll results the way they wanted to, and fed the audience what they wanted to hear.
Ever since, every time i see a column that cites Third Way polling, i call bullshit and call the piece crap based on unreliable polling.
Yeah, it's unreadable now, and light as a feather. This piece is from the year that she bought it, so she might not have gotten her claws into the content yet.
Although this article soft peddles the real issues, it does mention that Americans they interviewed do not like each other, "they do not want to get along." Molly Ball should have included the crime stats, economic data and vital statistics as context for interview responses! The voiced demand that everyone works, or that women should raise the kids, or the negative attitude towards big government needs to be probed further. Wages, unemployment, workers compensation, property taxes is context for emotional complaints, but so are divorce rates, child custody, and gender harassment. Harassment and humiliation are worse than the pandemic in American society - people are jealous of each other, mocking and humiliating each other, full of resentment. Our society is a big fight. Respect has been jettisoned. The appeal of a big fat cat is because Republicans just want guns and any old reason to hate others. This attitude comes out of the family - an hysteria of bullying!
In a half-hearted attempt to maintain a smidgen of perspective, I would remind you that media - or more accurately, the dissemination of news - has always been more about molding public opinion than about objectivity and reportage.
Whether it was the cherished works of Thomas Payne beating the drums of revolution, or the rancid lies of Wm Hearst making short order of weed and hemp, we've all been led by the nose for centuries (the bible?) by those who could afford a printing press (or digital platform).
"You spend too much time worrying about what people will think. I tell people what to think"
“To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.”
I was thinking the other day about the displays of the rich now vs the greed is good 1980s.
It used to be the point of being rich was to show off how rich you were. Conspicuous consumption and all that.
Now it is the opposite. The richer you are the less likely you are to display it. Outside of real estate and your kids education. And of course the sorts of vacations you take
But the rich now all think that they are all normal and down to earth. And the super duper rich are all here to save the world by re-engineering society in their mold. Bill Gates is a "benevolent" Lex Luther.
Andrew: Quick follow-up: do you think that the consumers of these media outlets even care that they’re brought to you by Pfizer? Because I see it as a problem, but I’m not sure they do at all. -I’m also not sure they don’t see it as a benefit, like who else should be sponsoring them? After all, they’re the ones that made the drug!
--------------
The consumers definitely do not. When you point it out they'll say things like, "Oh right, of course that's bad but..." and then they start making excuses for these outlets. They're brainwashed.
I had a conversation with my cousin where I pointed out that this is why I go to people on SubStack like TK and Greenwald and others for actual news stories and he just didn't get it. He could not understand the difference between going to an independent news outlet that gets its funding from paying subscribers and going to a news outlet that is bought and paid for by corporations. Because they both receive money he seemed to think they were the same.
"Doesn't TK need to say the right things so he doesn't lose subscribers? Isn't he writing stories so people will keep coming back?" This is the sort of stuff he would come up with, that you're tailoring your output to keep subscribers signing up. Never mind that you've been consistent in your views and the way you report things for your whole career.
I swear he is not an idiot, he is just that indoctrinated and that's what we are fighting against. People that are completely irrational, because they've been told that "news" comes from the news media and that is things like CNN and MSNBC and NYT (or if you're conservative, Fox News, the Wall Street Journal etc) and anyone else is some sort of social media ladder climber looking for more views so they can sell more t-shirts. In reality, it's completely the opposite. The major news outlets are the ones looking to sell more Pfizer ads so they say whatever the fuck Pfizer wants.
Anyone who can't see a diff between "an independent news outlet that gets its funding from paying subscribers" and a news outlet "that is bought and paid for by corporations", is too much of a fool to be worth talking to.
I'd not take the chance, that he may turn you into the Thought Police.
In 1969, I left the States for university in Spain (Barcelona/Ronda), under the watchful eye of Federico Franco, a fairly repressive dictator. We were allowed to read Cervantes, but no Basque or Catalan writers. The classes were patrolled by armed police. There were curfews...The newspapers were edited by approved proofreaders....and blue jeans were not allowed. There are times when urban visits feel like a reprise of those days -- Chicago schools are closed, armed security on Michigan Avenue -- even by the Art Institute...The old talk radio stations are now either cackling, infomercials for foodies and gear, or hard right fear-spewing oratories on crime. Is it any wonder that print media is for titillation, not education? "Journalists" gotta be part gumshoe and easy rider these days, and that information highway has some dangerous curves ahead. Great interview, Matt
Andrew (paraphrasing Thomas Frank): "...[journalists have] become the professional class, the adults in the room. They know that they’re the smart ones, the ones with the college degrees..."
I just wonder about that. Make no mistake, universities still habour genuine scholars who belong in academic environments and write wonderfully perceptive, painstakingly researched books worth reading. But by far the larger number of Americans (including, one would suppose, those who end up as journalists) emerge from their prohibitively expensive university experience no wiser or more 'adult' than before, and no better informed in most areas than readers of Wikipedia; and all too often they're full of resentment for those who haven't come by their ignorance the hard way. The motivation of graduates in a position to seize bully pulpits and tell others what to think and do may owe more to credentialism, and an aggrieved sense of what their entitlements ought to be, than to any real confidence in their intellectual gifts or competence.
The bona fide competence of plumbers and other tradesmen tends to unnerve these not-quite elite 'professionals,' and the truly smart among them realize their caricatures of the denizens of Montana and other 'flyover' states are cardboard cut-out stereotypes. Yet to the extent such stereotypes help fortify pretensions and perpetuate class divides that narrative spinners are desperate to believe they're on the right side of, they cynically, diligently reaffirm and patrol the borders.
Thank you for your hospitality in providing the written transcript along with the podcast. I listened yesterday and thought you and Walter Kirn had a great discussion. I very much agree about the cruelty of assorted pundits and comedians. The pushing of the Overton Window towards punishing the people who don’t go along with the mandates is not a little frightening. I hear the opening credits to Hotel Rwanda in those statements. We are in an unveiling the cruelty in our hearts. I just hope it doesn’t lead to violence, detention camps, the denial of health care coverage—all for a vaccine that doesn’t work, and may well make people sicker.
I very much appreciated your and Walter’s standing up for middle America. We are so not stupid as we are portrayed. We’re the ones who grow the food, truck it across country, repair your toilet, fly your jets.
I think the elites have lost common sense over Covid and the mandates. How is it a good idea to let the Washington state roads stay uncleared because the state refuses to let unvaxxed plow drivers help clear them. How is it healthy to let medical workers testing positive for the virus go to work, while not allowing healthy unvaxxed workers work?
At any rate thank you for your fresh take on our culture and great journalism. (Another subject to research might be the connection between anti depressants and mass shootings. I have heard that those are a common denominator along with guns. And a side effect is homicide and suicide, especially in young people.)
The day when the food truck drivers, the power linemen, the auto mechanics and HVAC repairmen discover that, acting as one, they can bring Hydra Media/Tech/Gov Oligarchy to its knees... well, strap in and pass the popcorn.
Men, men, men...a general strike by women (even just the ones who could get away with it) would bring the US to a screeching halt immediately.
Of course it would. We're in this together sisters. That's the biggest tool the ruling classes have; division, by gender is a big one, perhaps the biggest. Just another distraction from the solidarity we need.
Interesting, isn't it, that when you read my generic "mechanics" and "food truck drivers" you immediately assumed I was talking about men? Should I have said "linemen and linewomen"?
When you need something mechanical fixed, how often do women show up to do the work?
I live in Maine so the women are pretty rugged. But, I was responding to your use of linemen and repairmen. Actually I think we all should go on strike regardless of our gender, sex, or job description.
That day will never happen because when the workers realize that everything depends on them will be the end of the parasitic banksters conjuring up money from nothing and controlling us with it. Henry Ford said as much a century ago and we ain't figured out the scams yet.
Here in Illinois when restaurants defied the governor’s orders he yanked their licenses. The health care mandates are causing a shortage of health care workers, along with the infection, so the Feds bring in the National guard to help.
Spot on. We here have been subject to strict measures . Small businesses are fighting for their lives. And a couple weeks ago didn't the Gov discourage elective medical procedures? But, even though we have some of the most repressive pandemic measures, everybody is getting 'effin sick!
I want to believe that it is so ridiculous, that the rabble is going to turn out in huge numbers to go vote in November. I want to believe.
I hope so.
I have had the same thought. I wonder if the Covid related airline cancellations are also walk ours by pilots.
I've been saying the same thing about the drugging of our children.
Talk about dreadful. Don’t people worry about what these jabs will do to their immune systems? Covid hasn’t hurt them. Though the response to Covid, shutting down schools has been horrible.
I was driving down the road after my state shut down I
was thinking to myself, this crap is never going end.
Well the Wall Street Journal just posted an article that maybe masking and social distancing isn’t a good idea with Omicron. That we need to let it do it’s thing, so we don’t get something worse.
I got up this morning and turned on the local news and whether channel. First thing I heard was that some survey said people who wear masks are more attractive. I just shook my head. Propaganda at it worst.
That’s for sure.
Exactly, the "cure" is killing the patient (who as you point out isn't even medically ill).
I hope we come to our senses. Soon.
Not even close.This crap biowarfaecgain of function crap was given a thumbs. up in 2002 by … drumroll..W,after missing every screaming warning signa.He was worried about another Al. Qaeda attackSo he anointed Faustus.Remember the Anthrax Mailer? Falsely fingering Dr.Steven Hatfill, his reputation and career destroyed? But “they were mistaken” Let’s pin it on Dr Bruce Ivins and”suicide” him.Case closed. No, the Weaponized Antgeax Mailer was Al Qaeda, cooking it up at Ft Derrick. Another epic fail and cover up.What could go wrong with Mueller.Cofer Black,Brennan,Hayden,Gates,Baker behind the scene?The “ counter terrorism unit”.Al Qaeda had kind been active in the US.Daddy Bush could tell yo ou if his lips weren’t sealed.Clinton could tell you, but he missed the first WTC attack.W could tell you, but he’s a POS.Obama could telll you, but he was busy droning American citizens and arming Al Qaeda. Trump opted for Wray,Haspel,Rosenstein,Barr,McMaster,Mattis,Milley,Faustus,Collins,Redfield,Birx. He was “ advised” by the best.
Instead of opting for the purist,Terry Turchie,who would have brought them alll down
Me too.
Wishful thinking. The force (stupidity) is strong.
The word "cruelty" is what resonated with me. In today's St. Louis Post-Dispatch front page, "As overdose deaths hit new peak, response from Missouri divided." Since 1/1/20, " . . . nearly 900 accidental fatal overdoses in the city . . . about 200 more deaths than caused by COVID-19." We need more privileged brats on hunger strike at the MLK Memorial. Getting paid $15/hr. Hard to believe.
So often now, I feel I'm being gaslighted by the indoctrinated. I am dumbfounded by what seems to be the stupidity of people who should know better, that, at least at the elite level, there has to be some Machiavellian intent. And that makes me feel that it gives additional validity to those saying it's a coordinated (loosely) conspiracy to implement a One World Order by TPTB are correct.
This system, among other things, rewards people with sociopathic characteristics. So the most powerful are those with the least empathy. I don't think this is controversial these days.
And now that the power is getting more and more concentrated, the sociopaths among us are closer and closer to being able to feed everyone else into the Soylent Green machine.
Milo Minderbinder. Thank you for reminding us of him. JH should be required reading for anyone professing journalism.
Milo Mindbinder, a name worth committing to memory
This covers my annual subscription cost for a year. Awesome, awesome, awesome... and I will tell you why. It gives me hope that professional journalists, professional humorists, professional medical doctors, professional (fill in the blanks) will rise up and start to eliminate the unprofessional jerks within their professional designation that are destroying the brand and reputation of the profession.
The most important one is the profession of science. It is being crushed by the shysters like Fauci.
Science is continually challenging dogma. A never ending process
But Frank I thought Fauci was science 🤣🤣🤣
Indeed, one cannot put a price on hope
It is one of the biggest media travesties since the Iraq war, the facts that: it seems likely Fauci had at least some role in funding gain of function research on coronaviruses at Wuhan, the virus overwhelming likely originated from there, he likely lied to Congress about it, definitely was a key part of a conspiracy to dismiss and suppress those facts as unhinged conspiracy theory, and *still* somehow is considered someone with an ounce of credibility. Let alone the godhead of Covid truth.
Not to mention, this is the same Fauci who assured the American public that the Pandemrix vaccine was safe in 2009 in the midst of the swine flu epidemic, and it turned out to be rather not safe. The report is in the British Medical Journal from 2018, but somehow I've only ever seen it refered to once by anyone in the media.
Admit it. Fauci shouldn't be leading the crusade against Covid. Fauci ought to be defending himself against charges of conspiracy to commit murder via his project to develop a highly infectious viral vector. This, to me, is the craziest most unbelievable part of the whole rotten nightmare we are living. The man did it all and not only is he getting away with it, he's LAUGHING AT US.
Cornell West and Ana Kasparian said the same thing. "it's a manufactured culture war." Manufactured to keep conversation away from the topics that led to Bernie and Trump's populism. Namely, Americans are sick of fighting unjustified wars and would prefer that money be spent on a richer welfare state like other first world nations have. For example, parental leave. Americans are also pissed at economic crashes, the lack of decent paying jobs, their justice system, illegal immigration, and the expense of university. Long story short, if you care about these things, you're now standing up for yourself. If you and your partner live in the burbs with good jobs at Microsoft and healthy savings accounts, you selfishly vote to keep everything the same. This isn't tribalism. It's just politics.
The US is different than every other wealthy nation. It's rulers believe their enormous military must continually keep it's knife sharp by always participating in war, and that a first world welfare state is ideologically incorrect. As a result, not all Americans live in the First World. Many live above it and many live below. And, as always, if you wish to improve your situation, one must work / fight (lobby) for it.
As a non-American who's spent much time in your country, I think you have an awful lot of nice people who constantly get jerked around -- and nobody really cares about them. Then again, maybe the aristocracy is right. If you're poor, don't have kids.
Ana Kasparian.
I think she is part of the problem Matt and Walter are talking about. A shrill shill working the crowd to induce even more anger. Yes, this one time she may have said something truthful.
It is no accident that wokery, handmaiden of neoliberalism that it is, took off in the wake of the collapse of Occupy Wall Street, the first anti-plutocracy movement to gain any traction with the American public in decades.
Not on the wake of. When the union guys showed up, Obama had the CIA send in the progressive stack sticks.
With Biden, wages are up and unemployment is down; so are foreign interventions - far fewer drone strikes than trump the drone-striker!
Just exactly where do you get your Kool-ade?
Wages may be up, but then 7% inflation kind of makes those gains disappear.
Yes, Biden left Afghanistan, but he's poking the bear to have war with Russia.
Blaming Trump alone for the Drone Strikes, other than the completely stupid attack on Suleimani, is just ridiculous. Obama didn't stop them and Biden didn't stop them.
Thank you for posting that.
I live in Billings, MT, and we made the national news a few times for our "overrun" hospital here. (I think Walter Kirn was probably talking about Bozeman as that's more where the writers settle.) Of course, the locals would have told you there are two big hospitals in Billings. One of them was "overrun" and one of them wasn't, and the truth, the locals would have told you, was that the one that was "overrun" was a nightmare before COVID because of staffing shortages and a drive for profit over patient care and that it is frequently "overrun" during flu season. My further frustration is that we desperately need a conversation on our overpriced dangerous joke of a medical system in this country and the fact that it sucks us dry financially and can't even handle a small bump in need. But, no, instead we yell about vaccines and masks and never mention that the other hospital in town, the one that actually takes on indigent cases and therefore is often busier, was holding its own even in the worst of it, and discussing why that was and what we could take from it to improve the system overall. Instead the local newspaper seemed to literally forget that we had two hospitals and turned into a PR team for the one and then the story went national.
We've stopped going after the powerful, started criticizing random, powerless people in Oklahoma or Arkansas, or wherever. Comforting the comfortable and afflicting the afflicted. That's not how it's supposed to work.
That depends on your goal. It's far easier to punch down than punch up. But I agree.
Journalism died when print went away with it’s end if day print deadlines. Journalists had time to recheck their facts before the print deadline. The intranet requires no fact checking because the reward ceased to be accuracy and became speed. Who can get the story out first. It is akin to giving a classroom of students the highest grade for finishing a test first, regardless of checking for correct answers. Ridiculous!
I don't mourn the demise of the old print media.
Now it's up to the readers to perform the editing and fact-checking function, by putting their information processing into standby mode instead of falling for the first hot take they see or read. Contrary to popular belief, the first person to arrive at a conclusion about a given event or situation is not the smartest one. All too often, they're more like a kid playing with Tinker Toys.
The new media demands a lot more from readers. But it at least carries the potential to be a big improvement.
Great interview. A couple of thoughts.
First of all this bit - "Everybody thinks that because they went to a diner during a presidential primary, that they know the heartbeat of grassroots America."
I was kind of floored by a piece in The Atlantic back in '17 after the election. It was an excellent and eye opening piece, basically about how shellshocked liberals went to the heartland to find out exactly what these deplorables where thinking. The piece centers on the Third Way pollsters, and how the reality of what what they found caused extreme cognitive dissonance with what they expected to find. So they ignored the parts that caused dissonance and wrote up the poll results the way they wanted to, and fed the audience what they wanted to hear.
Ever since, every time i see a column that cites Third Way polling, i call bullshit and call the piece crap based on unreliable polling.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/10/on-safari-in-trumps-america/543288/
Every time I see "The Atlantic", I think Mrs. Steve Jobs' propaganda rag.
Yeah, it's unreadable now, and light as a feather. This piece is from the year that she bought it, so she might not have gotten her claws into the content yet.
Bingo
Although this article soft peddles the real issues, it does mention that Americans they interviewed do not like each other, "they do not want to get along." Molly Ball should have included the crime stats, economic data and vital statistics as context for interview responses! The voiced demand that everyone works, or that women should raise the kids, or the negative attitude towards big government needs to be probed further. Wages, unemployment, workers compensation, property taxes is context for emotional complaints, but so are divorce rates, child custody, and gender harassment. Harassment and humiliation are worse than the pandemic in American society - people are jealous of each other, mocking and humiliating each other, full of resentment. Our society is a big fight. Respect has been jettisoned. The appeal of a big fat cat is because Republicans just want guns and any old reason to hate others. This attitude comes out of the family - an hysteria of bullying!
In a half-hearted attempt to maintain a smidgen of perspective, I would remind you that media - or more accurately, the dissemination of news - has always been more about molding public opinion than about objectivity and reportage.
Whether it was the cherished works of Thomas Payne beating the drums of revolution, or the rancid lies of Wm Hearst making short order of weed and hemp, we've all been led by the nose for centuries (the bible?) by those who could afford a printing press (or digital platform).
"You spend too much time worrying about what people will think. I tell people what to think"
- Wm R Hearst.
And the beat goes on...
Speaking of Thomas Paine AND our own times:
“To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.”
― Thomas Paine, The American Crisis
At least the old elites had the decency to be villains. The new guys want to be heroes on top of everything else.
I was thinking the other day about the displays of the rich now vs the greed is good 1980s.
It used to be the point of being rich was to show off how rich you were. Conspicuous consumption and all that.
Now it is the opposite. The richer you are the less likely you are to display it. Outside of real estate and your kids education. And of course the sorts of vacations you take
But the rich now all think that they are all normal and down to earth. And the super duper rich are all here to save the world by re-engineering society in their mold. Bill Gates is a "benevolent" Lex Luther.
In the metaverse, the elites are gods
National treasure.
Obey your television
Do NOT think
Questioning masks is murder
Roll up your sleeve
This was all “predicted” decades ago.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FCcdr4O-3gE
--------------
Andrew: Quick follow-up: do you think that the consumers of these media outlets even care that they’re brought to you by Pfizer? Because I see it as a problem, but I’m not sure they do at all. -I’m also not sure they don’t see it as a benefit, like who else should be sponsoring them? After all, they’re the ones that made the drug!
--------------
The consumers definitely do not. When you point it out they'll say things like, "Oh right, of course that's bad but..." and then they start making excuses for these outlets. They're brainwashed.
I had a conversation with my cousin where I pointed out that this is why I go to people on SubStack like TK and Greenwald and others for actual news stories and he just didn't get it. He could not understand the difference between going to an independent news outlet that gets its funding from paying subscribers and going to a news outlet that is bought and paid for by corporations. Because they both receive money he seemed to think they were the same.
"Doesn't TK need to say the right things so he doesn't lose subscribers? Isn't he writing stories so people will keep coming back?" This is the sort of stuff he would come up with, that you're tailoring your output to keep subscribers signing up. Never mind that you've been consistent in your views and the way you report things for your whole career.
I swear he is not an idiot, he is just that indoctrinated and that's what we are fighting against. People that are completely irrational, because they've been told that "news" comes from the news media and that is things like CNN and MSNBC and NYT (or if you're conservative, Fox News, the Wall Street Journal etc) and anyone else is some sort of social media ladder climber looking for more views so they can sell more t-shirts. In reality, it's completely the opposite. The major news outlets are the ones looking to sell more Pfizer ads so they say whatever the fuck Pfizer wants.
I could not make him see this.
It's maddening.
Anyone who can't see a diff between "an independent news outlet that gets its funding from paying subscribers" and a news outlet "that is bought and paid for by corporations", is too much of a fool to be worth talking to.
I'd not take the chance, that he may turn you into the Thought Police.
In 1969, I left the States for university in Spain (Barcelona/Ronda), under the watchful eye of Federico Franco, a fairly repressive dictator. We were allowed to read Cervantes, but no Basque or Catalan writers. The classes were patrolled by armed police. There were curfews...The newspapers were edited by approved proofreaders....and blue jeans were not allowed. There are times when urban visits feel like a reprise of those days -- Chicago schools are closed, armed security on Michigan Avenue -- even by the Art Institute...The old talk radio stations are now either cackling, infomercials for foodies and gear, or hard right fear-spewing oratories on crime. Is it any wonder that print media is for titillation, not education? "Journalists" gotta be part gumshoe and easy rider these days, and that information highway has some dangerous curves ahead. Great interview, Matt
Walter Kirn's invocation of the Wizard of Oz reminds me of another version of that same myth via Malcolm Reynolds and the show Firefly.
"...they'll swing back to the belief they can make people... better. And I do not hold to that. No more running. I aim to misbehave."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VR3Av9qfZc
To looking behind the curtain, friends.
Andrew (paraphrasing Thomas Frank): "...[journalists have] become the professional class, the adults in the room. They know that they’re the smart ones, the ones with the college degrees..."
I just wonder about that. Make no mistake, universities still habour genuine scholars who belong in academic environments and write wonderfully perceptive, painstakingly researched books worth reading. But by far the larger number of Americans (including, one would suppose, those who end up as journalists) emerge from their prohibitively expensive university experience no wiser or more 'adult' than before, and no better informed in most areas than readers of Wikipedia; and all too often they're full of resentment for those who haven't come by their ignorance the hard way. The motivation of graduates in a position to seize bully pulpits and tell others what to think and do may owe more to credentialism, and an aggrieved sense of what their entitlements ought to be, than to any real confidence in their intellectual gifts or competence.
The bona fide competence of plumbers and other tradesmen tends to unnerve these not-quite elite 'professionals,' and the truly smart among them realize their caricatures of the denizens of Montana and other 'flyover' states are cardboard cut-out stereotypes. Yet to the extent such stereotypes help fortify pretensions and perpetuate class divides that narrative spinners are desperate to believe they're on the right side of, they cynically, diligently reaffirm and patrol the borders.