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Hugh Manatee's avatar

What you're describing is fascism and I don't disagree with your description of where we are going, but the rich are no one's friend except with their own kind. Throwing around the term "Marxist" is pointless and usually wrong. The Marxists aren't in charge--the rich are, and they ain't Marxists. It's a class war and the rich are winning.

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Janine's avatar

I disagree. It’s adapted Marxism, which is Marxism. https://youtu.be/4JX4bsrj178

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Hugh Manatee's avatar

The global fleecing by the rich and their corporations is Marxism? What colour are the skies in your world???

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Janine's avatar

It is EXACTLY Marxism.

Marxism is a two tiered system. The folks in the smaller tier have everything and all the power. The rest in the larger tier (almost everyone, and certainly all the meek), having been duped into renouncing all belongings, have nothing and no rights-including having no right to live if you disagree with the small tier that has all the guns.

Anything or anyone telling you that a workers utopia is possible, is planning on being positioned in the small tier/group.

History has done me the favor of proving my point. Yes, Marxism -as implemented by humans and not angels- has been tried before to bloody and miserable ends.

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Hugh Manatee's avatar

That isn't what's happening. The states to which you refer, i.e., China, the USSR, Cuba, Albania, etc., were dictatorships that borrowed the Marxist rhetoric but were never socialist. Marx was an economic historian who postulated that history was a series of class struggles where with each major shift in society, e.g., slave state to feudalism, there was a contraction in the number of social classes. He was always clear that you cannot have a socialist country in an ocean of capitalist countries. They all change or none of them do. The current state of late-stage capitalist states sees them in the hands of the oligarchs and their corporations. As capitalism dies along with the natural world that it has almost completely raped to death, it is being replaced with a new feudalism. Rather than devolving from an acquisitive money-grubbing society to a more democratic worker-controlled egalitarian society based on our needs and not our endless greed, we are being frog-marched by the obscenely wealthy back to a state of affairs we haven't seen in the West since the Middle Ages--begging for scraps at the feet of our new "lords". You've been distracted and misled by right wing talking points about Marxism in today's society. It's why the Nazis were called the National Socialist Party. "They're socialists and socialists are inclusive egalitarians, right?"--they were wolves in sheep's clothing. We are facing a feudal future brought to us by the brutal tools of late stage capitalism which are nothing more than fascist thuggery pitting us against each other over everything from jobs to affordable housing to myriad identity issues to immigration to reproductive rights to the need for endless wars. The end game will be martial law and the boot on our necks in the name of "security". Rather than debating semantics, we should be formulating a plan to push back. We have so little time to literally save ourselves. No one is going to do it for us. We have the numbers and they are oh so vulnerable and dependent on the rest of us to maintain their lives. They know this which is why they distract us with Trump and Biden nonsense. They're puppets. The powerful never take the stage because that would be showing their hand. It's now or never.

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Janine's avatar

"As capitalism dies along with the natural world that it has almost completely raped to death"

is how you reveal your hand as either a propagandist, or a person under the spell of propagandists.

"Raped to death" the earth is.

"wolves in sheeps clothing" have been all previous implementations of Marxism, says you.

Wrong Hugh. The wolves in sheeps clothing were the two who lulled you into a fever-dream that the greedy and corrupt could be overwhelmed by the good sheeps implementation of a 'fair system'. It's just THEM persuading you to hand them the circumstances of your own demise.

Define this for me: "our needs" (as opposed to "our endless greed"). Klaus Schwab seems to think we 'need (to own )nothing' and should be happy eating bugs. Is that what you had in mind?

Until you are willing to have the controllers in your dreamworld (cause there WILL be controllers) tell you what you do and don't want and need, you'd do well to hang onto your Representative Republic with all of the RARE AND UNPRECEDENTED rights it affords you as a citizen- even if it's REALLY mucked up at the moment.

The most important thing that history is showing us, is the fact that each and every time Marxism was sold to a population, it ended in misery, privation and death for them. You'd have to be Charlie Brown to expect any other result 'the next time'.

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