Bullshit! Admiral Bradley was the DEVGRU commander. He did this every day for years. He killed enemies of the state. Survivors were a mistake, and second and third strikes are routine. Obama ordered DEVGRU into Pakistan (in violation of "international law") to kill Bin Laden. (a correct order) We killed him, and we killed "civilians" as well. (to complete the mission) We didn't hang around to offer medical support, or fly survivors back out. I've worked with the teams, this shows how emasculated and ineffectual the LEFT wants our military to be. No victories, no results. Just hand wringing and finger pointing, pathetic!! Geneva Conventions, "shipwrecked survivors' "war crimes" Blah blah blah blah! More boat strikes, faster please.
What. An. Asshole. You are a CLASSIC example of the un-evolved knuckle dragging American shit for brain the whole world reviles. Violence. First (second) last and always. You are vomit personified.
Instead of hurling ad hominems, why not discuss the substance of what he laid out and how it applies to this situation? You arrive at the conclusion "Violence. First (second) last and always." without understanding his stance on negotiations - very poor form, IMO. Kinda makes you sound like the insults you project (?) on him...
If you’re referring to John I think he’s made his position quite clear. He’s a psychopath. Which goes a long way towards explaining his support of Trump. The guts of Taibbi’s piece cover all the issues.
It was quite good. Fair. Balanced. And followed almost instantly with a piece that outlines the hypocrisy of the Democratic Party and the MSM on the issue.
But this is the peanut gallery. I’m just another nut. Albeit sane. Unlike John. Who is BOTH a troll and a sociopath.
Yeah…well…you’re right. It’s weak. For sure. Anyhow my subscription expires in a few days. Kind of ironic that Taibbi would show his first sign of life (life=balanced honest holding of partisan feet to the fire) just when I’m bailing.
Thing is: it won’t last. Matt has demonstrated his priorities for quite some time. His mad-on revenge tour against the MSM and the Democrats will have a few tour cycles yet.
And as long as he’s partnering with Kirn on the podcast it will remain static.
My main source of edification was reading through the comments for funny takes and so forth.
But…again…you’re right. The foul mouth demonstrates I’m too lazy to argue with idiots like John.
I prefer NOT to make assumptions; in my experience it leads to more constructive interactions and less vitriol. He's addressing the competence of Admiral Bradley and referencing protocols used in similar past strikes.
Besides, I very much dislike when others assume things about me based on one posting.
so if you wish to use "past strikes" as justification for this then let's justify my lai. just because something happened before and went unpunished does not make it okay.
While no one can justify My Lai (Lt. Calley was the sole scapegoat, Medina and other higher ups skated, and Calley served only 3 1/2 years under house arrest, his sentence commuted by Nixon). Over a hundred were also killed in My Khe 4 by a different unit, B company. Most of the guilty went unpunished.
Wikileaks released videos of war crimes, helicopters shooting unarmed civilians and then civilians in another vehicle who tried to help survivors. The Granai Massacre in which 22 adult men and another 93 children were killed was also videotaped by the military and the US and its allies went to great length to destroy the video which Wikileaks never released (but Wikileaks not the war criminals were punished).
Three members of the al-Awlaki family, American citizens, were extrajudicially killed by three separate drones/military attacks over three years. No one was punished.
Wedding parties seem to be a common target of the US. Sadistic.
While war atrocities on the ground cannot be condoned they can be understood. The troops are brainwashed to dehumanize the enemy and many are in fear for their lives. Attacks from the air and drone attacks from a distance are much harder to justify but have become a mainstay of American foreign/ military policy. Is it escalating under Trump or just more transparent? There is no statute of limitations on murder but there is no/ minimal accountability for crimes by the US federal government, including the military.
I think either you 1) misread or misunderstood my post or 2) was replying to John and not me. In the case of the former, I'm not using anything to JUSTIFY anything! I was merely summarizing the gist of John's post in response to Lawyers comment that ASSUMED John was not "... a guy cheering all kinds of extrajudicial assassinations has a positive stance on negotiations?" That conclusion cannot be determined from the content of John's post, only assumed. That was the message in my post, followed by my distaste when people insert assumptions and draw specious conclusions absent real facts.
I have a problem with worthless drains on society like you who think your opinion matters. Violence is always an answer, always has been, always will be. Unless you’re a retard in this country that gets protected by people better than you.
lol your man TACO Trump is Dubya on steroids, another chicken hawk who will try to prove his manhood by invading little countries under false pretenses to prove his manhood. The only diference is he’ll sell us all out for a golf course.
I now read from a letter sent to Trump from one of Maduro’s aides, that adds additional motivation for the actions (“war”) against Venezuela. This is far beyond the alliance of Venezuela with China, Iran, Hezbollah. Several key points:
1) Cartel of the Sun is a gov’t planned and supported strategy targeting the US (supposedly suggested to Chavez, Maduro’s predecessor, by Cuba in the early 2000s;
2)Tren de Aragua recruited from prisons and deliberately sent to the USA during Biden’s term of open borders;
3) Deliberate plans to tap cables in the Caribbean to aid in spying on USA. Claims that US diplomats and CIA agents on the Venezuelan payroll. (Who knows, not at all surprising if true. Some say that these drugs provide a potent “off the books” funding for the CIA. Again, not surprising if true)
4) Venezuela the origin of Smartmatic electoral machines that can (may not always be) rigged. Who knows. Again, not surprising if true.
Matt, love your work but seems like there is ample territory to DIG DEEPER.
max Blumenthal has completely debunked the "cartel of the suns" it was a cia op which brought 22 tons of cocaine into the u.s. so they could supposedly track and identify distribution.
My understanding is that the survivors were trying to rescue the drugs on the boat, while phoning their fellow drug runners.
Doesn’t sound like a war crime to me. Have heard some compelling military lawyers so argue.
Look, the LEFT and the PROFESSIONAL PRESS hate Trump and will twist any story to stir up controversy. IIRC those dead from these drugs have long ago eclipsed the death count from Vietnam and Korean wars combined. And it is typically those with NO IDEA that the drugs they take are fentanyl.
2 drug dealers down….100,000’s young adults killed by fentanyl.. we’ve still got a lot of work to do. And I’m not about to cry a river for those two. Good riddance.
You have absolutely no proof of what was on those boats, and, as Glenn Greenwald pointed out in a recent episode, the claims of the numbers of Americans supposedly "saved" from overdose deaths are absurd.
Testimony from those who know the facts, saw the strikes. Footage showed the two “survivors” trying to reach their “colleagues” while trying to rescue some of the drugs on the boat. I believe this is why the NYT did not pile on to the Wapo reporting.
Sorry mate, but somebody's got to do it. We value your service. but the political leadership should be held at a higher standard. (Even “our guys.”)
How successful was DEVGRU?
We all know that our Afghanistan strategy ended in abject failure. The feckless Sleepy Joe certainly accelerated the collapse, but the Afghan National Government that we created was losing traction. Even the first Trump administration was negotiating a withdrawal with the Taliban. It was a tragedy, especially for you guys.
Now we are using those precedents to justify striking suspected drug smugglers in international waters. The impulse to step up interdictions without requiring a Coast Guard crew is understandable. However, an executive order designating criminal cartels as terrorist organizations and SUSPECTED cartel drug smugglers as enemy combatants takes us even farther from the plain language in Constitution that our officials and forces have sworn to defend. Congress has the right and responsibility to declare war.
The strikes on boats had broad, but grudging support. Video clips of the strikes can be entertaining. But, the notion of the second strike is like a whack on the crazy bone. It’s disorienting to those of us who still crave a return to something resembling normality in our country. (We really did believe that we might see an end to the “forever wars.” Looks like the US is facing a future of endless kinetic actions as more categories of enemy combatants are found.)
The tragedy here is that an inevitable future Democrat administration will find something
That these allegations took so long to emerge is an interesting story in itself. It does indeed have “all of the earmarks…” (Especially after the Kelly 6 tape.)
That we are spinning ourselves into a frenzy while our inevitable peer opponent watches with amusement from across the Pacific is heartbreaking.
DEVGRU has a 100% success record - if the intel is correct. (I don't think you know what JSOC is, do you?) They killed Bin Laden and 100's of others when ordered to do so. Our nations top 200 SEALs. Use all levers of American power against the drug cartels. Kill their leadership, interdict their supplies; sink their boats; destroy their harbors; strike their South American drug facilities and processing plants. Kill the people working there, destroy the infrastructure. The End.
I'm in defense - we are focusing on China, you are naive if you think otherwise. Thanks for the psychobabble. Blah blah blah blah. Some of us live in the real world son. Have a nice day.
Obviously, since we are practically at war with China, it's time to start shooting Chinese-looking people. They might be Filipinos or something but let God sort them out. American drug taker lives are at stake!
If we'd only taken this tough approach to rum runners during Prohibition, there would be no fetal alcohol syndrome, a personal problem that seems to make you angry. But your mom just wanted to have a little fun and your dad, well, an unconscious woman is just asking for it, amIright?
Pardon convicted drug trafficker who when was President of Honduras, convicted of trafficking gob smacking amounts of cocaine into the US. How’s that using for all levers? Trump is unhinged by greed. These guys are all snakes.
Trump does stupid things, along with other great things. I'll be glad when Trump is gone. But I do support the military strikes on the cartels. And you don't. And I respect our military. And you don't. And you denigrate and disparage their service and sacrifices. And I don't. And you think Kamala was preferable to Trump. And I don't. Let's keep this simple, shall we?
You put your finger on the dilemma - the quality of the intelligence.
I spent 3 mos in Sheberghan (granted the safest part of country under Dostum) in 2005 helping restore their gas fields. I heard plenty of stories over there ...
A very dear friend of mine was Naval Intelligence at Kandahar Airport a couple years later - target selection. Mostly social network analysis . The ambiguity of the data still haunts him.
Tactically, technically, you could claim 100% success for DEVGRU if you only count the defined missions. But, the strategy that it was attempting to support was a failure.
Those Operations were not in the glare of public scrutiny. These interdictions are not only publicized, but celebrated. That could help to discourage other would be smugglers, but it certainly increases the value of each subsequent cargo. These Operations seem almost designed to invite political opposition. I doubt this intelligence is any better than in AF or the wider GWOT. Any screwups will become hot and toxic real fast.
If we were serious about this effort, we would see legislation making Fentanyl trafficking in the US a death penalty offense (Works for Singapore).
(BTW, most of the folks reading this exchange are bashful, they don't post. But, they ARE the audience. You can dismiss me with "Blah, blah, blah," but you don't persuade the lurker. You just come off like a blowhard.)
Trump can be infuriating on some things, but I'm glad we've moved away from Romney/Bush republicanism. "Any screwups will become hot and toxic real fast." It was not necessary, the Left just made one up. But you seem concerned, nonetheless. Blah, blah, blah to the lurkers. It's why our leaders have never done these cartel ops, because they were weak, and worrying about public relations, not national security. Killing our enemies is never a failed strategy. The Afghan War was a strategic failure for sure - misguided political leadership from both parties. But our troops never lost a battle. And Bagram had real value, we should not have left. We were getting good intel and killing good high value targets. (you can't launch a rotary wing Bin Laden OP from Fort Campbell, KY) And the US casualty rate was effectively zero the last 4 years - the locals were fighting the Taliban. We have Spec Ops in 140 countries, the most important place we left. Right in the middle of Jihad Central. Stupid. And good luck with a "death penalty" and America's mostly woke and leftist judiciary. No chance. We'd just need a bigger "Death Row". Singapore is not a constitutional republic, although I do admire some of their laws - there are some Americans that could use a good public beating with sticks.
I agree 100% about Bagram. That was military malfeasance. (I've yet to hear of any consequences for any brass involved in that goat rodeo.)
Killing our enemies is not a strategy. (Hitler tried that, didn't really work out as he hoped.) It is a tactic intended to achieve a strategic, ie. political objective.
With a flexible definition of "enemy" the kill list can expand exponentially.
In this present case before us, I would like to learn about two metrics:
1) What percentage of cocaine cargoes in transit are we intercepting and destroying? (Can they convince the smugglers and skeptical observers like me that further smuggling attempts don't justify the expense.)
2) How does the expenditure to the US Treasury (and the already known pressure on our munition supplies) compare to the value of the cargoes being transported? (We've already been caught bare-butt stupid in the Red Sea defending against Houthi drones with SAM and fighter sorties costing a couple of orders of magnitude greater than the initial attack. ChiComs watching this, you can bet your bare-butt.)
The true question is "what is the bloody point?"
(Fentanyl, the universally acknowledged cause of most youthful deaths in this country, mostly comes from Mexico, assembled by several cartels from precursors imported from China.)
I'm sorry, but I don't believe that we are capable of stopping the flow of cocaine from Venezuela/Colombia.
Are we showing China our resolve? They have calculators and are learning more about our capabilities than growing respect for our awesomeness. (In any possible multiverse world, do you think that they are afraid of our fulsomely tattooed "Secretary of War?" Oh, he makes funny memes!)
This is a military-political stunt.
Trump has not deigned to give an address to the country.
(I'm old enough to remember when Johnson, a certified jack ass, told us about the Tonkin Gulf incident that justified the Vietnam war. I also remember so many friends that wanted to save Democracy and got really messed up.)
((Don't despise the lurkers. They ARE our audience. We want them to "like" us and maybe subscribe to us. Keep them in mind. You've got something to say, you don't need to censor it all away, but, don't let yourself get carried away.))
I lived in Singapore for four years and while some drug traffickers are hanged, others are caned, and children of "important people" involved in drugs are less harshly punished, according to locals in the know. Draconian and less corrupt than in most places, but still "gray areas".
Singapore made an example out of their only Olympic gold medal winner swimmer Joseph Schooling who admitted to using cannabis while out of the country, but mostly a S$10,000 fine and embarrassment.
Could not find the amount of fentanyl that would qualify for the death penalty in Singapore.
Thanks for for the "ground truth." We all do have a habit of ascribing the most sensational as the ordinary. But, what your evidence suggests is that Singapore does indeed make an effort, within the limits of its political culture (gotta be tricky balancing three ethnic groups) to address the demand side of the drug trade.
My point is that the supply side has powerful incentives to invest a lot of effort and capital in circumventing our video friendly operations. Until we get a better grip on the domestic market, they will move mountains to meet the demand. Basic capitalism ...
Killing Bin Laden without a trial was bullshit and murdering civilians on mere suspicion of intent to break US laws in the future is also bullshit. The DNC is not "the left", they are an authoritarian right wing party. Hope this helped you.
Correct! But the Left didn't kill Bin Laden. DEVGRU SEALs killed Bin Laden with Intel from water boarding! LOL 😂🤣😂 But Obama went against all Leftist bullshit and did the right thing. Good for him! Violated "international law". I approve, because there is no such thing! (it's why there are wars) AND I am against the Left wanting our military to be pussies, correct. (the Bin Laden raid an exception - Obama did it for politics) The question is this. I supported killing Bin Laden AND these cartel strikes - because I have a pro-American national security worldview. The Left supported the Bin Laden raid because Obama was President. They would have accused Trump of war crimes. Why is that?
They're hypocrites, no doubt. They want to bitch about these boat bombings but had no problem with Obama ordering the assassinations of American citizens.
Isn’t the Geneva Convention the reason we haven’t won a war since 1945? Even now if Israel wanted Iran defeated they should destroy water and power. Thats exactly how wars are won. What’s obviously failed is blowing up a few things and then building schools, sending food, and for what? Enemies learn nothing that way.
Oh boy Matt....are really jumping on the Henny Penny train? First off.....if this was REALLY a big deal, why did it take sooooooo long to say anything about it? It's almost they went digging to find something. As far as 'experts,' 'legal analysts,' etc.....did we not learn our lesson in COVID about people all too willing to share their opinions?
Just sayin.....let's just slow the fuck down here....and really, I think most Americans share my sentiment of 'they were fucking drug dealers, so fucking what?' It comes back to the old thing that has been eroding America.....everyone is all worried about legality when it comes to hurting a voluntary criminal, but never worried about what those criminals do to the people who aren't criminals.
Easy way to avoid getting blown up on a drug boat.....don't get in it. Don't start driving it towards the US.
I don't CARE if they did it intentionally or not. And these people do not in any way compare to the people killed at My Lai. Those people killed there were obviously civilians. The people on the drug running boats are obviously drug runners....and we are going to equivocate them?
I don't watch FOX....I don't watch CNN....I don't watch NBC, ABC or CBS. I watch YouTube TV, which has all manner of videos from every side. They are obvious drug runners. Y'all's little smirking insults don't work anymore. Nobody cares what you think...we are tired of people like YOU trying to bully everyone from seeing the actual truth. Y'all had your 15 minutes, now slink back into the shadows.
They are in specially outfitted boats with 4 high powered engines and no fishing gear. There are no boat races near where they are speeding through the ocean. They don't have living quarters, so not yachts. The boats contain bales or barrels of material that completely fill the hull. If they AREN'T running drugs, what ARE they doing? Delivering talcum powder?
Why do we have to care for criminals? Sorry, there are so many Americans that deserve our attention. My personal opinion here..the Epstein, MRI stories are busts. They did go digging and found this new story. The WAPO, who is famous for anonymous sourcing, released. That in itself should make us pause.
To all those bashing Matt, we don't need to be throwing personal insults just because we disagree with him. He did research, he stated his conclusions with his (as usual) entertaining writing style. (He even warned us a few days ago he'd be taking a new tack likely to piss everyone off.) Fine to disagree with his level of concern (I don't share it myself) but no need for trash talk. We wouldn't love Matt so much if he were a Sean Hannity clone.
What I would love to know is the ideological mix of your readership pre- and post-Twitter Files.
Like Stevie Ray said, you are stranded, caught in the crossfire. The regular Dems think you've gone MAGA, as do the MAGA folks who thought you had become one of them. Don't pay none of them no mind, and keep doing what you do, brother.
Thank you for sharing this. As a total layperson in the business of news and politics, it's so hard to discern the truth. My heartstrings tug when I think of killing survivors, and then I think, wait, in war, with brutal enemies (in this case, drug smugglers who seem to be indirectly killing hundreds of thousands), the goal is elimination. War is brutal. Humans are wicked. It's a mess out there.
If they are facilitating crimes on American soil (and themselves facilitated by a foreign state), but never actually enter American territory, are we to leave them untouched, and thus leave ourselves subject to their hostile actions? It seems like critical law does not apply here. It does seem like the laws of war are more applicable. It would be nice if we had clarity about when we are at war, and with whom, and how it has been constitutionally declared.
A rare bit of slop from you. I won't bother to take it apart, your analogies are absurd. If the boat still contained drugs that could be salvaged, it could legally be hit again no matter who was clinging to it. Double taps were/are the norm on the GWOT. I'm normally a huge fan but this piece is a stack of blather and nonsense.
Sorry, I just don’t buy that drug dealers are terrorists who can be summarily executed. That’s law enforcement and we can easily board/seize these boats. I didn’t think this was legit with “terror suspects” in Pakistan either. I looked for lawyers who agreed with the administration and found one, printing his point of view, but I don’t see it.
Sorry Matt but calling powerful drug cartels simple "drug dealers" is ridiculous. Their weaponry and resources are larger than some countries. Their political connections south of the border are mind boggling. They are bringing drugs into the US that can kill every one of us many times over. The "war on drugs" is finally becoming a war and many of us are thankful for it.
We don't know who was killed in these boats, or what their crime was. For all we know they were coerced by the cartels into getting on them. And now, if the cartels are sly, they'll load them up with women and children.
The US government thinks they can execute anyone they want (even citizens) as long as they are not within US borders. This started openly with Obama's drone program. Trump is just continuing the tradition. We are living in dangerous times.
Interesting that the kill ‘em all hard ons like Mike M have fuck all to say about the demand side of the equation. Why not start firing missiles at every junkie wandering around the streets of Goodle USA?🇺🇸
Ha! My point (apparently too subtle) was that drug cartels are several orders of magnitude more serious than your average drug dealer. Basically at the same level as terrorists when it comes to arms, people, tactics and political connections - which was the comparison that Matt was not making in his comment.
Junkies are not... but they definitely need to be arrested and detoxed.
All the dealers in between the cartels and the streets also need to be imprisoned.
See? I'm not a "kill 'em all" guy.
But let's talk about JP Daly... what if anything do you recommend the US government do about cartels? Specifically. And how do you think it will differ from all the previous actions over the last 40 years?
What I suggest Mike is that you include the demand side in your thinking (not that you’ve impressed me as a thoughtful man); then you issue a broad warning to drug runners. Attempt to import drugs into the USA and you will be shot on sight.
Take one step back…
Make that the law. Importing drugs into the USA is a capital offence. Further; write into that legislation that drug smugglers will be summarily executed. No trial.
Then present the evidence.
The reason you’re an asshole Mike is that you imply (every time you open your pie hole) that you’re on the right side. But you’re obviously too fucking lazy to BE on the right side.
Here's a crazy idea - legalize ALL drugs. Poof, cartels gone. Poof, dealers gone. Poof, drug crime gone. Poof, drug-RELATED crimes (burglaries/muggings/theft, gang warfare/shootings) gone (because prices would plummet). Poof, related government corruption gone. I bet you have no idea how many societal institutions (police, lawyers, judges, mayors, legislators, private prison systems, military leaders, intelligence and regulatory agencies, etc) actually benefit/profit from the drug "war" due to drugs being illegal.
Then, divert drug war-appropriated funding (and private prison subsidies) into prevention-focused education of potential users, and rehab/jobs programs for current users. Food for thought.
appreciate all the work and certainly your thoughtful views, as you can appreciate your audience of the same.
If drug dealers are not terrorists, what are they? Pick another word from the thesaurus. I lean towards killers of US citizens.
Then what ever your word is, we are at war with them! And I believe we need to do whatever is needed to stop the assault on our citizens, before those people make landfall.
I believe it is a waste of time to:
send a cutter to pick them up, arrest them, motor them to the nearest US dock, drive them to jail, feed them, allow phone calls, afford them a visit with a judge, have their -US paid defense councils do their bidding with the judge, have them released in their own recognizance, or stay longer in our jail etcccc, then 18-24 months later, have said judge and jury perhaps find them innocent of "killing citizens" because they did not actually give the poison to our people, merely dropped it on shore etcccc. And if by some miracle they are found guilty of something, they sit in our jails getting all the free stuff their country does not provide them, and they get multiple appeals etc.
Dropping one or two bombs on the boat, as needed to sink the vessel, destroy the cargo and eliminate the "threat" , is much preferred by me, and I sleep very well at night, despite too much wine sometimes.
All this was fine when other presidents/admins did it, but not for #47. so sad.
They’re businessmen. They are meeting a demand in a market. They would be powerless if the demand didn’t exist. They would not smuggle drugs if that demand didn’t exist. The demand is the problem here, and it’s a problem that exists within American culture.
Bradley, try doing some volunteer work with drug addicts. They perhaps innocently tried drugs, probably like we all did. But, when you spend time with those that would cut their right arm off to quit but can’t, your eyes open. They are literally doing drugs against their will. Most will die because they can’t quit. The drugs are being created to be super addictive.
I don't know if he's blaming everything on users, just pointing out that it is, indeed, a demand issue. Just like abortion--the states with the least effective sex education lead the nation in teen pregnancy. And they try to outlaw the supply, but do nothing for the demand.
I know all about drug addiction, having lost a brother to it. Bombing motorboats in the Caribbean is doing jack shit to stop drug addiction. It's just murder for murder's sake.
Completely agree. The drug epidemic is the result of spiritual and moral decay - and the endless wars (on terror, drugs, Putin etc.) contribute to the moral decay and squander resources that could go towards rebuilding/ repairing our society. America’s #1 priority, for some bizarre reason, is stuff outside our borders. No wonder our home is decaying.
it starts with a personal decision, Marie. Practically everyone starts voluntarily, and that's a situation that doesn't bear any resemblance to being strafed by a machine gun. And even in the case of lethally dangerous drugs, most of the users are not addicts. As with alcohol use, 20% of the user population accounts for more than 80% of the demand. The users surveys make that clear. Perhaps that's why the Trump administration has worked to defund SAMHSA.
Bullshit. If there were no supply of drugs then no one could ever get addicted to them. You have to go after both supply and demand. But you damn liberals don't want to us to do anything. You give out free needles to drug addicts instead of putting them in rehab. You refuse to do "Say No To Drugs" programs. How does that reduce the demand? Then you say not to go after the suppliers. How does that solve the problem? It doesn't.
And he did blame someone, the "American culture". In other words every American. So I guess America is the only country that has any drug use. You damn liberals just can't help yourself, you just have to blame Americans for everything.
"They're businessmen" he says. No, they run an international drug cartel selling drugs that they know have killed and will kill hundreds of thousands of people worldwide. They are murderers. You damn liberals don't give a damn about the people they kill. Only those poor innocent "unarmed drug dealers" as Matt Taibbi calls them. You damn liberals are EVIL.
Don't ask stupid questions. Drug manufacturers and smugglers are fulfilling a demand in a market. People manufacture poisons all the time, chemicals which are far more deadly than drugs, and nobody is seeking to assassinate the businessmen who manufacture them. If someone ingests poison on purpose, that's their problem. The same logic applies to drugs. Killing the manufacturers will not eliminate the demand for drugs. Many addicts would literally die of withdrawal if they don't get the chemicals on which they are dependent. Bombing motorboats in the Caribbean is the most sadistic, evil, and ineffective method of solving the drug problem in America. You people who defend this are fucking nuts. Psychopaths.
I have two words for drug dealers: drug dealers. This idea that everyone who does anything bad or unlawful is a terrorist is ludicrous. It also doesn’t fit any legal definition of terrorism.
Doesn’t anybody care about the hundreds of thousands of people who are killed and will be killed by these “drug dealers”? Or is this just politics as usual?
Richard, you don’t even know they are drug dealers. Why are you suddenly trusting the government? Have you been asleep for the past 25 years as the government designated an ever-widening circle of individuals and entities “terrorists” - and squandered more and more of your tax money “fighting” them?
interesting name you have, is that a name of a salad or something I recall.
anyway
our troops have physically gone to the blown up boat sites and have confirmed drugs were on the vessels.
I believe this is a fight we need to continue as we do very little relative to the supply side, while weakliy trying to staunch or lower the demand side. We give addicts too much leeway and not enough consequences.
To be clear personal suffering and continued drug use are NOT consequences for drug addicts. These are simply "the fruits of their bad decisions".
As some have said, "addicts cant stop" or maybe, we make it too easy to not stop. Real consequences are incarceration, perhaps some slow form of withdrawl management, cold turkey stop for some. I dont purport to know all the details of addiction and you can yell at me if you want for "being ignorant". I do know that punishing bad behavior (drug making, drug running, illegal drug use etc) is a deterrent.
Perhaps the most public/strongest form is a bomb on a boat to perhaps dissuade others. If not, at least we slightly reduced the number of drug runners.
It is a tough situation to be sure. I fully support taking action on sea and on land against the illegal drug cartels/industry/runners that are wreaking havoc on our population. Will we get it 100% right NO. Sorry for what we get wrong but that is life in the drug biz.
The folly of the Drug War is the conceit that legal penalties play some crucial role in “deterring” decisions by people to use lethally dangerous drugs. We have decades on end of evidence to the contrary. Understand the risky preconditions under which people are using them: they’re purchasing a product of unknown purity and quantity that might kill them. Every new purchase of a lethally dangerous drug carries that risk. If that reality isn’t deterring someone from voluntarily choosing to use a dangerous drug, the legal risks aren’t going to deter them.
“Not enough consequences”? Really?
This is not the same thing as saying that society should tolerate public drug use, or ignore enforcement of the laws against shoplifting, car-break-ins, ignoring curfews in public parks, or any of the other malum in se criminal offenses committed by dysfunctional drug abusers and addicts. But drug use is not a criminal behavior in itself, and it’s been a huge mistake to treat it that way. Personal possession of alcohol was not criminalized during alcohol Prohibition. User criminalization would not have deterred users, it would have made the situation ten times worse.
As for the illicit market: any honest assessment has to include both sides of a prohibition policy: criminal penalties do work to keep many people out of the business of supplying the demand. But they also amount to conceding a career criminal monopoly over the supply of the forbidden substance. That means that drug dealers are subject to arrest and conviction for unscrupulously providing unsafe substances to an unregulated consumer market. A market of people voluntarily purchasing the substance, at their own risk. An official U.S. government policy that classifies drug dealers as terrorists is ridiculous. And if its faulty logic is accepted, that policy will be applied within U.S. borders.
"Perhaps the most public/strongest form is a bomb on a boat to perhaps dissuade others." -- Then we'd have to bomb commercial and military aircraft out of the sky, as well. You do know drugs also enter our country that way, no?
Do you honestly think bombing a few boats will have any impact whatsoever on the drug supply? The CIA burnt down fucking hundreds of acres of coca plants in Columbia and all it did was shift production to Bolivia. The drug war is a demand problem. If there is demand, supply will find a way. The only solution is to end the drug war and legalize and regulate like alcohol and cannabis. It’s the least bad solution.
Matt is spot on in his analysis. Killing drug traffickers in international waters is not armed conflict. Not by any stretch of the imagination. And if you start defining terrorist and armed conflict so broadly it’s not too far to consider the same rules of engagement at home with citizens. How is this any different than bombing a truck on a highway in California. Do you think our government should be doing that as well?
yeah, international waters are where you can beta test your rocket strikes all nice and legal-like, as part of a publicity campaign to equate illicit drug marketing organizations with armed terrorist groups.
"If drug dealers are not terrorists, what are they?" -- Look up the definition of terrorism. No, dealers are more akin to entrepreneurs, as they run a business with the intent of making money, not with the intent of terrorizing and killing people. That may be a consequence of their business, but it's also a consequence of the quite legal pharmaceutical and other industries.
hey gang, and I dont use gang in a "gang" sense, assuming y'all can differentiate this from me.
Unless or until, the drug dealers/terrorists/ drug runners/narco terrorists etc , step foot on US soil, I am fully supportive of our government/agencies/military taking these folks "out".
Sure we have done nefarious deeds over the years, sorry. (btw both sides of the aisle are culpable).
One said "drug dealers" are in biz because we have addicts.
Well the US has done little to cure addiction. So since we have fallen short of curing addiction, it is ok to bring drugs to America? I say NO.
Do what we need to do to stop the flow of drugs into the US. Outside our borders it is fair game/open season. Beg for forgiveness later, if needed.
Dude, take a step back. YOU are the one advocating for terrorism. Going around the world blowing people from other countries up because we have a problem with them and their governments? That’s called terrorism.
You conflate bombing people with doing what it takes to end drugrunning, but bombing obciously and naturally increases terrorism, which funds itself by drugrunning. You are calling for more drugs and drug dealers. Thats the whole point, it doesnt work the way you want it to.
I’ve never seen a speedboat injecting anyone with drugs. People run away from bullets and bombs and shrapnel. Illicit drug users run toward dealers, with wads of cash in their hand. And then they use the drugs themselves. Which are risky, but not to be compared with hot lead. No one is forcing them to do it. The coercion is all going the other way.
I used to believe something like what you say. Seeing strung out druggies die in the street (I saw it in Portland) has greatly weakened my former libertarianism.
what, am I supposed to be impressed? Are you also a paid subscriber to Kevin Dahlgren's Substack, like I am? I drove the night shift for years on end, and you think you can lecture me based on some inside personal observations?
I challenge you to round me up some junkies who blame their habits on the evil drug dealer terrorists who force them to keep taking drugs.
Some drug markets need to be illegal. Cocaine, strong opioids, fentanyl. But drug dealing is not terrorism. It isn't to be used as an excuse to push the envelope of officially ordered murders.
Once the logical premises of the Trump administration's justification are accepted, the door is opened to a police state. No take-backs.
Is it a waste of time to arrest, charge, and try criminals in the United States? Should the US military and police just summarily execute anyone suspected of wrongdoing?
Drugs kill both Americans and illegal aliens, who are useful, inexpensive workers. So these are terrorists on hotels and car washes and are harming the economy! All this legal mumbo jumbo is a cumbersome waste of time when we need to protect our drug takers.
We’re twisting around the axle of defining ‘terrorism’, which is far as I know does not have an agreed-upon definition. What we do know is that there is a supply problem and a demand problem. One ‘would think’ that the drug dealers are now reconsidering the value proposition of getting into their 1000hp boats with a load of drugs and heading our way. (I am glad the MSM has stopped insulting the intelligence of some of us and calling these vessels and their occupants ‘fisherman’. Trolling and long-lining at 70 mph…..right….). There is not, and probably never will be, the institutional courage to address the demand problem. Cases in point - nicotine addiction and the movement from cigarettes to vapes. It won’t be too many more years before the public health hell that vapes cause will become apparent, and cost ALL of us. Now we have weed for sale that is X times more potent than was sold on the ‘black market’ not that long ago. Legalizing these drugs will just multiply the number of people face down on the sidewalk. Corporate food - no courage or foresight there either. Our country was far worse off than others during covid because we are generally fat and really unhealthy. Soon enough the excitement over this will pass and there will be a new flavor of the day to try to make the current administration look bad, only because it’s the current administration doing “it”, regardless of how consistent the actions are with prior administrations.
"We’re twisting around the axle of defining ‘terrorism’, which is far as I know does not have an agreed-upon definition." -- I think the dictionary would beg to differ.
"Trolling and long-lining at 70 mph…..right…." -- So, boats going that fast can only be carrying drugs, and for no other reason?
The War on Drugs is 54 years old. Started by Nixon. Drug cartel leaders “kingpins” are targeted and killed by government operations. The alphabet agencies do a lot of these missions, most that we never hear about. Unfortunately, because of TDS, there are no secrets in DC. Everything that can cause harm to this administration will be anonymously released. Does it matter if we blow up a drug cartel boat in the Caribbean or go into Mexico and murder a kingpin? I bet there’s a treasure trove of murderous info that has taken place over 54 years that would make the bleeding hearts go away crazy. If we can find a way to stop these drugs from killing our children’s, I’m in.
“Drug cartel leaders “kingpins” are targeted and killed by government operations. The alphabet agencies do a lot of these missions, most that we never hear about.”
So, Marie. how have you heard about it, then?
Anyway, what’s up with the Honduran guy who just got released from prison, Hernandez? He was part of a ring that smuggled an estimated 550 tons of cocaine:
And President Trump pardoned him. Not just clemency, he pardoned him.
But back to your original claim: if the US Government has been assassinating “drug cartel leaders “kingpins”” for the past 54 years, why hasn’t the assassination squad project succeeded yet?
Assassination squad, 😀don’t think I ever said those words. I feel I may have hit a nerve. Look, it’s true we been fighting this war on drugs for 50 years. I don’t know the in and outs, but most likely if one “kingpin” is removed there’s a line ready to replace. I’m sitting in a spot that basically doesn’t care if we blow up some drug boats. Right or wrong, I just don’t care. I’m sick of what it’s doing to our youth. Some kid takes a pill one night for kicks and it’s laced with some shit that kills him. Should he have taken it, no. But I did plenty of stupid crap when I was young, but this lethal crap was not something to worry about back then. It’s a new ball game.
Your statement that "Drug cartel leaders “kingpins” are targeted and killed by government operations" does fit the dictionary definition of "assassination", yes.
You sound like you don't realize how corrupt the drug game is, Marie. Granting extraordinary powers to the government on the basis of a phony equation of "drug dealers" and "terrorists" is exactly how we end up with a death squad police state.
After 54 years, don’t you think it’s time to try something new? We’re doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. Every kingpin we take out just creates a power vacuum for a new one to emerge. Sounds like a dumb strategy
NY Post today reported drug boats seized. Coast guard helicopter blew up their engines, then coast guard vessel boarded boat. They seized cocaine, a lot. Look it up.
That shows you that the ordinary interdiction tactics work--without going completely lawless with no due process and summary execution. You should read Jack Beavers' Substack page.
Your Rolling Stone/Mother Earth DNA on full display here. They can and should be executed. Requiring our troops to board their boats exposes them to unnecessary danger and will only lead to protracted, ultimately unsuccessful prosecutions.
By that logic, we should just execute every American who commits a crime to avoid any "protracted, ultimately unsuccessful prosecutions." Heck, think of all the taxpayer money we could save doing away with our entire justice system.
Dated info I think. These boats are now capable of doing 130mph. We have no USCG or Navy craft that can go that fast. And even if they did running alongside them with a megaphone yelling "Hey guys can you slow down....what are your names..we need to know your names first...oh, are those drugs...could you pull over please we just want to inspect? Doesn't work sending a message via a lethal air strike force will get the word out. The number of boats is already down. Feckless Democrat politicians and their lying mockingbirds in the press haven't a clue what an effective war on drugs needs to look like.
Let’s assume this happened, which is one of the jobs of the CG. A helicopter was involved and that means a limited range. The CG has approximately 147 helicopters covering the entire US coastline. To operate with a greater range, a cutter that can carry a helicopter must be used. This further limits those types of operations.
Yeah, we could capture them. They would then be let back out on the street by a liberal judge and back into another boat in short order. How is that a deterrent?
I disagree on the point that drug cartels are not terrorists. How is importing large quantities of a deadly substance into the U.S. and distributing it, resulting in thousands of ongoing deaths not a terrorist act? If not, exactly how would the analysis be different if they were importing anthrax? I will agree that the double tap events, if proven, are a huge problem legally, morally, and just as bad PR. So I guess I get the honor along with Matt of pissing off everyone at once.
How would the analysis be different if they were importing anthrax? American recreational anthrax use is pretty low and tends not to be voluntary. Didn't really "catch on" as a party drug for some reason.
By that logic, we'd also need to designate as 'terrorist organizations' the pharmaceutical and other companies whose products have resulted "in thousands of ongoing deaths."
Drug dealers and terrorists use the same tactic Matt, fear. It ensures their users/victims never have the opportunity to fight back with equal or superior force. Taking either of them out before they harm more innocents isn't necessarily a bad thing. For example, how many of these narco-boats were flying their country's flag so we could assess if they were 'friendlies' or not? If no flag, aren't they by international rules, pirates? How many friendly pirates have you met that follow international laws?
Comparing this to the post 9/11 reaction is a real stretch. We're talking about surgical precision strikes against gangsters delivering poison in international waters, not the Patriot Act or regime change.
This is analogous to how the US dealt with the Barbary pirates.
Many of us are not on board with you on this one, but I appreciate your take/stance entirely. I think about some of the Asian countries' zero-tolerance drug policies as opposed to the toothless and pointless "war on drugs" the US follows. Arresting the drug runners, going to trial, half-assed sentences..rinse and repeat. And the drugs keep flowing with zero consequences to all parties involved except the users and society in general.
Again, I appreciate you focusing on this. It helped me think a little more deeply. I don't want an audience captured Matt ever.
But the law disagrees with you. I actually share your reservations about the entire enterprise, whether a terrorist or not. But here we are.
That said, I've been studying up on our operations against the massive cartes and their transshipment operations. A military type of response seems justified.
What I'd prefer is legislation from that broken institution, congress, authorizing use of force in specific ways for specific intentions. But hey, that's not possible in a late stage empire in the midst of a slow motion collapse. Our governing elite can't muster up the coherent, moral and patriotic will to work together and govern sensibly.
Again, so here we are...I remain a huge admirer and very much appreciate the response.
Tony Soprano performatively murdered cops, judges, lawmakers, mayors and journalists in order to demonstrate that he and his boys were in charge, not they? I must have missed that.
I'll also add that it's clear to me that the 40 year LE effort has failed and that the host nation govts can't or won't eliminate the cartels. I'm not willing to see our SpecOps folks used to kill goat-herders halfway around the world while we let these animals wild on uw.
The Coast Guard does board and seize boats all the time. Drones and helicopters are used on the fast boats that are too fast, too maneuverable and can go in shallower waters. It's not like the Coast Guard isn't at work here. It would be interesting to know how the crews seized by the CG are handled.
Laws are for cowardly pussies. Our American drug takers lives are at stake! Suspected drug dealers or "mules" should be strung up like suspected cattle wraslers or whatever they were called. Frontier justice will save American lives and end drug use forever.
Matt, these are not pot-smoking "drug dealers" selling dime bags to high school kids at carnivals. These drugs have killed hundreds of thousands of young American citizens. The utter disregard for these lives is astounding. This is unbelievable!!
Welp, I guess we should just bomb into oblivion the pharmaceutical companies making, and pharmacies distributing, all the opioids killing "hundreds of thousands of young American citizens" as well.
if you can’t understand the difference between Al Capone and Osama bin Laden, you’re in no position to criticize someone else’s analogies as “absurd.”
Yes, drug dealers are criminal outlaws, subject to arrest and felony conviction for unscrupulously providing unsafe substances to an unregulated consumer market. A market of people voluntarily purchasing the substance, at their own risk. An official U.S. government policy that classifies drug dealers as terrorists is ridiculous. And if its faulty logic is accepted, that policy will be applied within U.S. borders.
LE has failed to deal with this massive threat fpr 40 years.
I don’t like the term terrorist to begin with and lumping all those threats together in that way. But it’s what we have. We can get away with calling them terrorists legally, so I say fine. The Cartels have military style, nation-state defying militant capacity. And the economics to pay for it.
In a narrow sense, I get your point and ‘agree’ with it. But we live in an imperfect world with imperfect laws. The Cartels running amok in South America are an ongoing crime against humanity so I’m cool with whatever legal gymnastics need to be done to destroy them.
Consider the guy who Donald Trump just pardoned: Juan Orlando Hernandez, former President of Honduras.
From the Wall Street Journal, March 31, 2022: "(Hernandez is facing charges in the US that he took bribes from Latin American drug cartels and helped them smuggle 550 tons of cocaine to the US. Hernandez has denied the charges. It was a stunning turn of events for the former president, who ran the country for eight years on a platform of stamping out corruption and standing up to drug cartels."
Hernandez was eventually convicted, of course. Before Trump pardoned him, a year later.
I've had muggers attempt to mug me three times, none were successful because I had a reaction utterly different than you describe. As for the pardon, I think it's about politics in the region, which by necessity must be 'real politik'. You've really not made a point I can sink my teeth into here.
My point was that I'm willing to use the legalistic framework of an attack by a hostile non-state force to justify using military force against these huge, multi-billion transnational criminal organizations. Another factor which drives me to this position is the failure/corruption of the national governments in these countries. They operate in cooperation with elements of the national governments in very serious ways and exercise control over
large areas inside these countries.
When I pile all this up, I'm willing to hide behind any fig leaf I can find to blow them to shit, ya? As I said upthread, I'd much rather congress pass laws and authorizations to deal with these real threats but we'll never see that. Cuz congress is broken. Not saying my position is awesome, but there it is.
Drug smuggling is not an "attack" on the US. It's just an industry that profits from selling terribly unsafe products to willing consumers. And one of the points that you've missed is that the historic corruption related to illicit drugs is not confined to south of the Texas border. What you hand-wave as "real politik" is an example of that corruption, at the highest level of the US government.
You just want to "blow [the mythic villains you've conjured] to shit" because you think that's the key to getting the rest of the world to Obey your wishes. The rest of the world keeps reminding you that that your Power To Control is limited, and you don't like that.
You don't get my analogy about the mugging because it was intended for readers other than yourself. You want to be on the mugger's side. The inauguration of a sado-moralist police state isn't viewed as a problem by the people who think they'll benefit from it.
If there's a War for the West, I'm trying to save the West from the Murphy game of criminals and seditionists who claim to be the police when they're really the muggers.
I worked CT/CN (counter narcotics & terrorism) in LATAM from 1997 to 2006 (with a two-year hiatus to command a Harrier squadron and deploy it to Bagram in 2003). I got to see the cruelty that the FARC, ELN, and AUC exacted upon poor farmers and their children (machete amputations of ears and tips of noses). Like all commissioned officers, I was trained in the Law of Armed Conflict, the UCMJ, and attendant ROE & RUF. I hate the narcos to the marrow of my bones. I also despise the complicit press and their disinterest in deviations from legal use of force when Obama did it.
I am bone weary of fighting gang, terrorist, cartel, and their enablers with one hand tied behind our back. They are becoming more aggressive and sophisticated, while leftist apologists run interference for them. In this environment, the good guys can’t win, and the bad guys make the world worse.
I wish for all to understand the distinction that I draw between moral philosophy and the rule of law. Law is constantly perverted, and not just in the U.S. International conventions are a mess. They begin to resemble a Rorschach ink blot inasmuch as political ideologues and power centers leverage law to serve their parochial power purposes. Laws have migrated from morality to the degree that it’s against the law to pronounce “Arkansas” incorrectly. In Connecticut, pickles cannot be sold unless they “bounce.” I won’t bore you with further legal idiocy.
In this military case, we are addressing nationally sanctioned killing of narcoterrorists who are paid to facilitate drug exportation and kill people while imagining that they are noncombatants. Leftist assertions that these are “just criminals” worthy of due process, completely ignore the human suffering that the activity of these parasites impose upon humans in both the precursor and destination states. This is such an old argument, and honest people disagree. Our enemies exploit our devotion to the rule of law in order to defeat us.
To those who demand that WE be punished for killing cockroaches, I wish to learn their strategy for ending the narcotic subversion of the USA. I demand victory, not surrender to the scum of the earth.
ideology has nothing to with the facts of the case. You're indulging in pettifoggery. A version of Critical Theory. Abstraction and Semantic redefinitions, manipulating language elasticity until you can can get to the Desired Result. Whereas actual critical thinking relies on facts about specific cases, and logical inferences about precedent incidents. And the baseline honesty to recognize the difference between an illicit global market with a demand that's only too popular worldwide, vs. an armed political insurgency targeting the United States.
As I'm taking you at your word, stay tuned for a brief flyer about the uh SOUTHCOM situation representation, with some background. I'll be posting it here. It's all unclassified. Yet somehow very secret, can you beat that? I need some time to write it, luckily I have some.
Or you could take this as an early notice to block me. I've never blocked anyone. But I'm aware that people do.
I don’t lose sleep over social media antagonists. It wouldn’t cross my mind to block you…or anybody. It seems that you have experience with being blocked. I don’t.
While I’m up, here’s something that you may find interesting reading: annual survey reports on the use of drugs, including prescription pills, alcohol and tobacco—including last 7 days; last 30 days; previous 12 months. Two different reports- one for high school students surveying use for 8th graders, 10th graders, and 12th graders; and the survey for users age 19-65.
The surveys have been done by the University of Michigan Monitoring The Future program since the mid-1970s. Every annual report between the years 1975 and 2024 is available to read for free. This is the longest running survey available. https://monitoringthefuture.org/results/annual-reports/
The Feds have some similar survey reports.* SAMHSA, ONDCP, CDC. But none of them go back as far as the U. Michigan Monitoring the Future reports, which cover a wide range of behaviors, not just drug use. I think the SAMHSA reports only go back to 1992 or so. I’ll find them soon. They’re a good check on the U. Michigan reports. For what it’s worth, the surveys track quite closely. It’s just that the U. Mich reports go back all the way to 1975. That improves the perspective considerably.
(*Or they used to, they may have been cut by DoGE this year.)
The weird thing about blocking people online is that only the person doing the blocking experiences it.
After around 4 years on Substack, I only found out about my being blocked by anyone a few weeks ago, by downloading the free app BlockedStack. Otherwise, I would never have known.
lol, you showed up ten years after the coca trade spread from Bolivia and Peru to Colombia. And I bet you think you're a real expert in how that happened.
I suppose I'll have to assemble some facts and figures.
"Tired of fighting the cartels with one hand tied behind buh buh buh buh"
Yes, but WHY is it a war crime? It's mostly a war crime because we don't want them to do it to us, i.e. that's why we created a convention and a treaty on it. But these people, unlike German and Japanese officers in the past, are never going to be in position to order their own side to do things like this.
Personally, I'm cool with it. I don't prefer it, but I'd rather worry about shooting more boats than navel gazing over this. That doesn't mean I want to do it to the Russians, because they feasibly would be in position to do it to our folks. But lawless civilians running drugs? (non-citizens, that, is, everything would be way different for Americans, or even for boats flying a national flag and following the rules)
I seriously couldn't give a fuck, and I didn't vote for Trump (or Biden or KH) and don't have a care about which way this all goes for him. I think trying out the war on drugs as an actual war is a good experiment to run.
The list of war crimes from WWII and Vietnam is long, and much of it is much, much worse than this. ONE PERSON served time over My Lai. No one could claim they were just "following orders" because all of those giving orders WERE ACQUITTED.
" But these people, unlike German and Japanese officers in the past, are never going to be in position to order their own side to do things like this." Actually Kelly one could argue that these people have already done it to us. The fact that they are shipping poison into our country killing hundreds of thousands of people is reason enough to bomb the hell out of them in my opinion.
Agreed one thousand percent. I agree that they end up killing our citizens. And yes, us not a single one of them is going to look at someone addicted to their product who is likely to die with the next hit and not sell it to them. No mercy coming our way from these fuckers. (Yes, I know this group deals in cocaine - but if you haven't hit a nightspot in a decade, there are fentanyl test strips being sold because people are dying from everything these days since it can get adulterated).
I do enjoy how My Lai is constantly brought up as the quintessential example of "you can't use following orders as a defense" when the military court didn't find him guilty despite "just following orders", they ruled that there was no evidence such an order was given. The guy that purportedly gave the order got off scot free, was acquitted. It takes 5 minutes to learn this on Wikipedia but everyone walks around with the wrong picture in their head and spouts off on it all the time.
Well, right before that, in vs. 19-20, God does say that:
19 And of every living thing of all flesh, you shall bring two of every sort into the ark to keep them alive with you. They shall be male and female. 20 Of the birds according to their kinds, and of the animals according to their kinds, of every creeping thing of the ground, according to its kind, two of every sort shall come in to you to keep them alive.
Here he says "build the ark like this and we're gonna take two of everything". And then he says specifically "now get on the ark with seven pairs of everything clean and two of everything else"... and then "Noah did all that the Lord commanded him"
This is at best WHY people may be confused. But they are confused. And we're taught the beginning without even a hint of controversy, difference, or the potential for additional info, which is entirely misinformation, just like all other misinfo people believe.
Military convention only works when it is followed by both sides. The drug cartels are ghoulish in their treatment of their enemies and are terrorists in every sense of the word. You can wring your hands over the fineries of military justice but these animals have earned everything they’re getting. To treat them as conventional military opponents simply ignores what is necessary to fix the problem. This story is absolutely going to wither from public indifference to these attacks. They’ll likely be applauded instead. Honestly, I’d move on from this story.
I didn’t experience a whole lot of outrage in the media as in Obama was ripped for blowing past ostensible War Powers guidelines in an action that probably should be more infamous than it is. None at all really. I do get a sense that air strikes on drug laden speed boats is getting a lot more attention solely because it’s Donal Trump’s administration. I really do get that sense. Where was the media when Quadafi (sp) was blown up in Libya? (Was it his family too? I don’t remember). Where was the media when Biden blew up the Nordstream Pipeline II and then said he didn’t do it and went to extreme lengths to cover it up? The list goes on. Someone’s quoted in your article, “this is the dumbest shit he’s ever done.” Is that give the order for a second strike? Or is that start up with Venezuela and the drug cartels? You don’t specify. And a lot of experts have been and will be trotted out. More than the usual. But this particular story is the kind where the facts change daily. Were you aware there were JAG officers in on the consultation on this controversial air strike. That’s what I am told. Can you verify that? Would like to know what they said. So much I heard …. It’s been reported….here’s this experts opinion….well the two men were in the water helpless…..well the two men had climbed back on the boat and potentially could have been maybe been trying to contact other cartel boats or something….So all we’re left with is speculation. Unless we’re getting eyewitnesses accounts, and we’re not. I am confident the “experts” can recite the law and do little more than speculate on the facts. Thats what I count on independent media for a better understanding of the reality of what occurred. Give us some hard facts and a timeline. Have said that, I admire the quality and difficulty of your work.
No you are right. Somebody corrected that earlier. The U.S. didn’t actually commit the killing. There’s others though. Greg Collard and Matt Taibbi’s most recent article. Out today goes into some of it.
Matt, your really becoming a mainstream ally . One, The story was debunked in the New York Times. two the main street media is looking for anything to try and justify the video that came out from the six idiots who told the military to ignore orders. They didn’t like. Three if the boat was not totally destroyed it and still had drugs on it it most certainly could be hit again to make sure that nobody comes out to get those drugs.
What is this Venezuelan thing about, anyway? I mean, really about? Somebody in Trump's orbit has apparently convinced him Venezuela had something to do with the 2020 election steal. Rubio has a long-standing and public animosity against the last and current Venezuelan regimes. I'm sure the fact that this is also a way to stick it to China is helpful, as well. It's got to be more than oil or drugs. Considering that Trump recently pardoned JOH, who was convicted of flooding the US with cocaine, this Venezuelan escapade can't be about drugs. Saying it's because of "narco terrorists" is like pointing at the mouse (Venezuela) in the corner and screaming about it while ignoring the massive elephant (Mexico) sitting in the middle of the room. I'm less concerned with the hypocrisy (that never changes from either side), but at the intentions and reasons behind this insanity.
Update: To those who thought including the 2020 election bullshit in this post was crazy, you were wrong. Trump has issued multiple posts today (1/5/2026) on Truth Social regarding Venezuela and the 2020 election. Open your eyes.
Plus opening up the rest of Venezuela's natural resources to American corporations, as our puppet Maria Machado has promised she'll do once we've regime-changed Maduro for her.
Agreed. If this were truly about drugs, we’d be bombing Mexico and China. This seems like Trump letting Rubio and the other south Florida neocons run amok. I wonder if by this time next year, we’ll be bombing Cuba.
I listened to Brian L Cox, a Cornell Law professor, on The Megyn Kelly Show on Monday. He had a totally different opinion that made sense to me. Respectfully, this does not. So many pundits. So little time.
He's one of the few people who really understand this. Specifically, assuming the boat was a military objective, attacks could continue until it was no longer of value to the enemy. Critics stupidly assume the attack was aimed at the people, when the objective was the boat and its cargo. (Of course we now know the WaPo report about targeting survivors clinging to wreckage was nonsense. A second attack on the vessel, yes, that happened.)
And here comes the Trump apologist brigade! If you railed against Obama for these same types of actions and ignore or hand wave these serious allegations then you're part of the problem.
Similarly, if you didn't rail against Obama for these same types of actions and all the sudden have issue with the current admin... you are part of the problem. Selective outrage works both ways... we are seeing it big time with immigration enforcement this year.
I did. The drone strikes from the Obama admin were one of the first things that made me drop the rose-colored glasses on him as a young voter at the time. Its a shame so many can turn a blind eye when its your "team". The difference here is this admin is so beyond childish with their troll-like responses to any questions.
Dustin, the fact remains that you care more about these two drug cartel members than the hundreds of thousands of Americans their drugs have killed and will kill. By all means, let's keep killing our young Americans because we have to stop Trump at all costs.
It really is funny. They've taken all the great reporting he's done exposing Dem corruption at face value but, when its their boy, all of a sudden they're singing a different tune.
It’s not a different tune. We disagree with Matt’s assumptions. Notice, we have not been disparaging him. It’s called dialogue. Maybe something you’re not familiar with.
I thought we declared a War on Drugs? Seems like everyone wants to hit the fucking easy button all the time and not do the hard work and take the flack to unwind the generation of fuckery foisted upon us by the Uniparty. Looks like Matt is headed back over the fence also. Sad, really.
Exactly right, sir! The "War on Drugs", like the "War on Terrorism" is known by everyone with a functioning brain to be an absolute fraud and lie. The only purpose for each was to inflict violence for blatantly evil political ends. These pathetic rats cheering on the boat strikes pretend to care about the damage of drug addiction, but this has never once been a concern of right wingers. It's just what they think they have to say, right now, so they can toady for Trump. As long as the members of the Sackler family walk around free and unharmed, then every one of these Trumpies is a knowing liar.
I stopped reading when you said "Law professors and military analysts struggled to find words." I assumed you meant leftist attorneys and self-proclaimed "military analysts" who hate Trump.
Bullshit! Admiral Bradley was the DEVGRU commander. He did this every day for years. He killed enemies of the state. Survivors were a mistake, and second and third strikes are routine. Obama ordered DEVGRU into Pakistan (in violation of "international law") to kill Bin Laden. (a correct order) We killed him, and we killed "civilians" as well. (to complete the mission) We didn't hang around to offer medical support, or fly survivors back out. I've worked with the teams, this shows how emasculated and ineffectual the LEFT wants our military to be. No victories, no results. Just hand wringing and finger pointing, pathetic!! Geneva Conventions, "shipwrecked survivors' "war crimes" Blah blah blah blah! More boat strikes, faster please.
What. An. Asshole. You are a CLASSIC example of the un-evolved knuckle dragging American shit for brain the whole world reviles. Violence. First (second) last and always. You are vomit personified.
LOL 😂🤣😂 Fuck the "world". It only exists because America allowed it to. Don't get any vomit on your skirt. You must be Canadian . . . or worse French.
Look mouth breather! You got 25 thumbs up! Your mother and father must be SO proud 😂
French!! I knew it!! Aluhah Akbar!!
Leave the killing to us, thank you. You're not qualified.
Instead of hurling ad hominems, why not discuss the substance of what he laid out and how it applies to this situation? You arrive at the conclusion "Violence. First (second) last and always." without understanding his stance on negotiations - very poor form, IMO. Kinda makes you sound like the insults you project (?) on him...
If you’re referring to John I think he’s made his position quite clear. He’s a psychopath. Which goes a long way towards explaining his support of Trump. The guts of Taibbi’s piece cover all the issues.
It was quite good. Fair. Balanced. And followed almost instantly with a piece that outlines the hypocrisy of the Democratic Party and the MSM on the issue.
But this is the peanut gallery. I’m just another nut. Albeit sane. Unlike John. Who is BOTH a troll and a sociopath.
No, my response was to you using words and phrases like "Asshole", "un-evolved knuckle dragging American shit for brain" "You are vomit", etc..
Yeah…well…you’re right. It’s weak. For sure. Anyhow my subscription expires in a few days. Kind of ironic that Taibbi would show his first sign of life (life=balanced honest holding of partisan feet to the fire) just when I’m bailing.
Thing is: it won’t last. Matt has demonstrated his priorities for quite some time. His mad-on revenge tour against the MSM and the Democrats will have a few tour cycles yet.
And as long as he’s partnering with Kirn on the podcast it will remain static.
My main source of edification was reading through the comments for funny takes and so forth.
But…again…you’re right. The foul mouth demonstrates I’m too lazy to argue with idiots like John.
No it doesn’t. It just shows your true colors.
I agree with you bailing. I have been considering it for quite some time. kirn is insufferable.
I respect your honest self-reflection. Most people on-line would just hurl MORE insults at me!
You think a guy cheering all kinds of extrajudicial assassinations has a positive stance on negotiations?
I prefer NOT to make assumptions; in my experience it leads to more constructive interactions and less vitriol. He's addressing the competence of Admiral Bradley and referencing protocols used in similar past strikes.
Besides, I very much dislike when others assume things about me based on one posting.
so if you wish to use "past strikes" as justification for this then let's justify my lai. just because something happened before and went unpunished does not make it okay.
While no one can justify My Lai (Lt. Calley was the sole scapegoat, Medina and other higher ups skated, and Calley served only 3 1/2 years under house arrest, his sentence commuted by Nixon). Over a hundred were also killed in My Khe 4 by a different unit, B company. Most of the guilty went unpunished.
Wikileaks released videos of war crimes, helicopters shooting unarmed civilians and then civilians in another vehicle who tried to help survivors. The Granai Massacre in which 22 adult men and another 93 children were killed was also videotaped by the military and the US and its allies went to great length to destroy the video which Wikileaks never released (but Wikileaks not the war criminals were punished).
Three members of the al-Awlaki family, American citizens, were extrajudicially killed by three separate drones/military attacks over three years. No one was punished.
Wedding parties seem to be a common target of the US. Sadistic.
While war atrocities on the ground cannot be condoned they can be understood. The troops are brainwashed to dehumanize the enemy and many are in fear for their lives. Attacks from the air and drone attacks from a distance are much harder to justify but have become a mainstay of American foreign/ military policy. Is it escalating under Trump or just more transparent? There is no statute of limitations on murder but there is no/ minimal accountability for crimes by the US federal government, including the military.
I think either you 1) misread or misunderstood my post or 2) was replying to John and not me. In the case of the former, I'm not using anything to JUSTIFY anything! I was merely summarizing the gist of John's post in response to Lawyers comment that ASSUMED John was not "... a guy cheering all kinds of extrajudicial assassinations has a positive stance on negotiations?" That conclusion cannot be determined from the content of John's post, only assumed. That was the message in my post, followed by my distaste when people insert assumptions and draw specious conclusions absent real facts.
Sorry, John. My response was intended for John Patrick Daly, who, rather than address what you said, reverted to ad hominem (at the person) insults.
Sorry!!
You look like a homeless drug addict. How about leaving the man shit to real men you emasculated shit stain fag?
That’s rather homophobic my good man. Do you have some issue with homosexuals?
I have a problem with worthless drains on society like you who think your opinion matters. Violence is always an answer, always has been, always will be. Unless you’re a retard in this country that gets protected by people better than you.
Such a charmer!
This is who you want having your back when shit hits the fan folks! 🤦♂️
This is why there is no civil war scenario for real. The left will be opening umbrellas to protect the fallen from unforgiving automatic weapons fire.
That’s good Kelly, got a nice chuckle and a great image
lol your man TACO Trump is Dubya on steroids, another chicken hawk who will try to prove his manhood by invading little countries under false pretenses to prove his manhood. The only diference is he’ll sell us all out for a golf course.
Chickenhawks are very much a bipartisan issue.
Who cares what you think?
I do.
Be less of a pathetic cunt
I now read from a letter sent to Trump from one of Maduro’s aides, that adds additional motivation for the actions (“war”) against Venezuela. This is far beyond the alliance of Venezuela with China, Iran, Hezbollah. Several key points:
1) Cartel of the Sun is a gov’t planned and supported strategy targeting the US (supposedly suggested to Chavez, Maduro’s predecessor, by Cuba in the early 2000s;
2)Tren de Aragua recruited from prisons and deliberately sent to the USA during Biden’s term of open borders;
3) Deliberate plans to tap cables in the Caribbean to aid in spying on USA. Claims that US diplomats and CIA agents on the Venezuelan payroll. (Who knows, not at all surprising if true. Some say that these drugs provide a potent “off the books” funding for the CIA. Again, not surprising if true)
4) Venezuela the origin of Smartmatic electoral machines that can (may not always be) rigged. Who knows. Again, not surprising if true.
Matt, love your work but seems like there is ample territory to DIG DEEPER.
https://pjmedia.com/sarah-anderson/2025/12/04/maduros-ex-insider-turns-snitch-and-sends-trump-an-explosive-letter-n4946687
max Blumenthal has completely debunked the "cartel of the suns" it was a cia op which brought 22 tons of cocaine into the u.s. so they could supposedly track and identify distribution.
I believe the letter is from a new source, recently at Maduro’s “right hand”.
I've read the unsupported allegation. Not the first time I've read one of those.
Guess we’ll see. So MANY things I would never have thought true turned out to be so.
The marriage of money and power is a dangerous elixir for so many folks.
My understanding is that the survivors were trying to rescue the drugs on the boat, while phoning their fellow drug runners.
Doesn’t sound like a war crime to me. Have heard some compelling military lawyers so argue.
Look, the LEFT and the PROFESSIONAL PRESS hate Trump and will twist any story to stir up controversy. IIRC those dead from these drugs have long ago eclipsed the death count from Vietnam and Korean wars combined. And it is typically those with NO IDEA that the drugs they take are fentanyl.
2 drug dealers down….100,000’s young adults killed by fentanyl.. we’ve still got a lot of work to do. And I’m not about to cry a river for those two. Good riddance.
Oh FFS.
You have absolutely no proof of what was on those boats, and, as Glenn Greenwald pointed out in a recent episode, the claims of the numbers of Americans supposedly "saved" from overdose deaths are absurd.
Stop being so gullible.
Fentanyl doesn't come from Venezuela so what the fuck are you talking about
Sorry, cocaine that is ultimately laced with fentanyl…nice guy!
Where does the fentanyl come from
Probably from the CIA. Drugs are their "sideline" job.
Your “understanding” based on what?
Testimony from those who know the facts, saw the strikes. Footage showed the two “survivors” trying to reach their “colleagues” while trying to rescue some of the drugs on the boat. I believe this is why the NYT did not pile on to the Wapo reporting.
“Testimony from those who know the facts.”
I am aware of no such testimony (which is a statement under oath).
Please be specific: who testified when? And provide links/sources.
Also, link to the footage.
Admiral Bradley testified in Congress today to this effect.
Got it, thanks. Have been at work all day but will check out the testimony tonight.
You're too stupid to read today's news, and think the internet is your butler.
Peace be with you.
Sorry mate, but somebody's got to do it. We value your service. but the political leadership should be held at a higher standard. (Even “our guys.”)
How successful was DEVGRU?
We all know that our Afghanistan strategy ended in abject failure. The feckless Sleepy Joe certainly accelerated the collapse, but the Afghan National Government that we created was losing traction. Even the first Trump administration was negotiating a withdrawal with the Taliban. It was a tragedy, especially for you guys.
Now we are using those precedents to justify striking suspected drug smugglers in international waters. The impulse to step up interdictions without requiring a Coast Guard crew is understandable. However, an executive order designating criminal cartels as terrorist organizations and SUSPECTED cartel drug smugglers as enemy combatants takes us even farther from the plain language in Constitution that our officials and forces have sworn to defend. Congress has the right and responsibility to declare war.
The strikes on boats had broad, but grudging support. Video clips of the strikes can be entertaining. But, the notion of the second strike is like a whack on the crazy bone. It’s disorienting to those of us who still crave a return to something resembling normality in our country. (We really did believe that we might see an end to the “forever wars.” Looks like the US is facing a future of endless kinetic actions as more categories of enemy combatants are found.)
The tragedy here is that an inevitable future Democrat administration will find something
That these allegations took so long to emerge is an interesting story in itself. It does indeed have “all of the earmarks…” (Especially after the Kelly 6 tape.)
That we are spinning ourselves into a frenzy while our inevitable peer opponent watches with amusement from across the Pacific is heartbreaking.
DEVGRU has a 100% success record - if the intel is correct. (I don't think you know what JSOC is, do you?) They killed Bin Laden and 100's of others when ordered to do so. Our nations top 200 SEALs. Use all levers of American power against the drug cartels. Kill their leadership, interdict their supplies; sink their boats; destroy their harbors; strike their South American drug facilities and processing plants. Kill the people working there, destroy the infrastructure. The End.
I'm in defense - we are focusing on China, you are naive if you think otherwise. Thanks for the psychobabble. Blah blah blah blah. Some of us live in the real world son. Have a nice day.
Obviously, since we are practically at war with China, it's time to start shooting Chinese-looking people. They might be Filipinos or something but let God sort them out. American drug taker lives are at stake!
You're retarded.
If we'd only taken this tough approach to rum runners during Prohibition, there would be no fetal alcohol syndrome, a personal problem that seems to make you angry. But your mom just wanted to have a little fun and your dad, well, an unconscious woman is just asking for it, amIright?
Then we wouldn’t have the Kennedy clan..
Tough upbringing there, champ. Stay strong.
Now, now. Fun is fun, but ...
That would have been illegal.
Your problem is you can't tell the difference.
Although droning Canadian bootleggers in the 20's does sound like fun!!
" American drug taker lives are at stake" way to show your true colors.
Pardon convicted drug trafficker who when was President of Honduras, convicted of trafficking gob smacking amounts of cocaine into the US. How’s that using for all levers? Trump is unhinged by greed. These guys are all snakes.
Trump does stupid things, along with other great things. I'll be glad when Trump is gone. But I do support the military strikes on the cartels. And you don't. And I respect our military. And you don't. And you denigrate and disparage their service and sacrifices. And I don't. And you think Kamala was preferable to Trump. And I don't. Let's keep this simple, shall we?
Red herrings and ad hominems. That'll show her!
And you are ..full of yourself. You know nothing about how I feel about the military. How you arrived at such conclusions is …?? LOL
You put your finger on the dilemma - the quality of the intelligence.
I spent 3 mos in Sheberghan (granted the safest part of country under Dostum) in 2005 helping restore their gas fields. I heard plenty of stories over there ...
A very dear friend of mine was Naval Intelligence at Kandahar Airport a couple years later - target selection. Mostly social network analysis . The ambiguity of the data still haunts him.
Tactically, technically, you could claim 100% success for DEVGRU if you only count the defined missions. But, the strategy that it was attempting to support was a failure.
Those Operations were not in the glare of public scrutiny. These interdictions are not only publicized, but celebrated. That could help to discourage other would be smugglers, but it certainly increases the value of each subsequent cargo. These Operations seem almost designed to invite political opposition. I doubt this intelligence is any better than in AF or the wider GWOT. Any screwups will become hot and toxic real fast.
If we were serious about this effort, we would see legislation making Fentanyl trafficking in the US a death penalty offense (Works for Singapore).
(BTW, most of the folks reading this exchange are bashful, they don't post. But, they ARE the audience. You can dismiss me with "Blah, blah, blah," but you don't persuade the lurker. You just come off like a blowhard.)
Trump can be infuriating on some things, but I'm glad we've moved away from Romney/Bush republicanism. "Any screwups will become hot and toxic real fast." It was not necessary, the Left just made one up. But you seem concerned, nonetheless. Blah, blah, blah to the lurkers. It's why our leaders have never done these cartel ops, because they were weak, and worrying about public relations, not national security. Killing our enemies is never a failed strategy. The Afghan War was a strategic failure for sure - misguided political leadership from both parties. But our troops never lost a battle. And Bagram had real value, we should not have left. We were getting good intel and killing good high value targets. (you can't launch a rotary wing Bin Laden OP from Fort Campbell, KY) And the US casualty rate was effectively zero the last 4 years - the locals were fighting the Taliban. We have Spec Ops in 140 countries, the most important place we left. Right in the middle of Jihad Central. Stupid. And good luck with a "death penalty" and America's mostly woke and leftist judiciary. No chance. We'd just need a bigger "Death Row". Singapore is not a constitutional republic, although I do admire some of their laws - there are some Americans that could use a good public beating with sticks.
I agree 100% about Bagram. That was military malfeasance. (I've yet to hear of any consequences for any brass involved in that goat rodeo.)
Killing our enemies is not a strategy. (Hitler tried that, didn't really work out as he hoped.) It is a tactic intended to achieve a strategic, ie. political objective.
With a flexible definition of "enemy" the kill list can expand exponentially.
In this present case before us, I would like to learn about two metrics:
1) What percentage of cocaine cargoes in transit are we intercepting and destroying? (Can they convince the smugglers and skeptical observers like me that further smuggling attempts don't justify the expense.)
2) How does the expenditure to the US Treasury (and the already known pressure on our munition supplies) compare to the value of the cargoes being transported? (We've already been caught bare-butt stupid in the Red Sea defending against Houthi drones with SAM and fighter sorties costing a couple of orders of magnitude greater than the initial attack. ChiComs watching this, you can bet your bare-butt.)
The true question is "what is the bloody point?"
(Fentanyl, the universally acknowledged cause of most youthful deaths in this country, mostly comes from Mexico, assembled by several cartels from precursors imported from China.)
I'm sorry, but I don't believe that we are capable of stopping the flow of cocaine from Venezuela/Colombia.
Are we showing China our resolve? They have calculators and are learning more about our capabilities than growing respect for our awesomeness. (In any possible multiverse world, do you think that they are afraid of our fulsomely tattooed "Secretary of War?" Oh, he makes funny memes!)
This is a military-political stunt.
Trump has not deigned to give an address to the country.
(I'm old enough to remember when Johnson, a certified jack ass, told us about the Tonkin Gulf incident that justified the Vietnam war. I also remember so many friends that wanted to save Democracy and got really messed up.)
((Don't despise the lurkers. They ARE our audience. We want them to "like" us and maybe subscribe to us. Keep them in mind. You've got something to say, you don't need to censor it all away, but, don't let yourself get carried away.))
"I'm sorry, but I don't believe that we are capable of stopping the flow of cocaine from Venezuela/Colombia."
I tend to agree. Smugglers always find a way, unless they have no product to move. Maybe we should be targeting the crop?
I lived in Singapore for four years and while some drug traffickers are hanged, others are caned, and children of "important people" involved in drugs are less harshly punished, according to locals in the know. Draconian and less corrupt than in most places, but still "gray areas".
Singapore made an example out of their only Olympic gold medal winner swimmer Joseph Schooling who admitted to using cannabis while out of the country, but mostly a S$10,000 fine and embarrassment.
Could not find the amount of fentanyl that would qualify for the death penalty in Singapore.
Thanks for for the "ground truth." We all do have a habit of ascribing the most sensational as the ordinary. But, what your evidence suggests is that Singapore does indeed make an effort, within the limits of its political culture (gotta be tricky balancing three ethnic groups) to address the demand side of the drug trade.
My point is that the supply side has powerful incentives to invest a lot of effort and capital in circumventing our video friendly operations. Until we get a better grip on the domestic market, they will move mountains to meet the demand. Basic capitalism ...
JSOC is great at killing. Just ask Pat Tillman's family.
Rangers are SOCOM, specifically USASOC.
JSOC is not SOCOM, and reports directly to the President.
Special Forces Operational Detachment—Delta (Delta Force)
Navy Special Warfare Development Group (DEVGRU)
24th Special Tactics Squadron (Air Force)
Why do you seem so happy? You're a fucking ghoul. Get help dude. God I hate anti-American commie bitches . . .
SMD dude.
Again…the “real” world. Fuck. Inmates at an asylum live in the real world too. You’ll be there soon enough. Asshat.
You're not in the real world inmate, obviously! How'd you get on a computer? I'm contacting the front desk . . . back to the rubber room for you.
💯‼️👏👏👍
So...you're happy the LEFT killed bin Laden, but unhappy the LEFT wants our military to be pussies...
So which is it?
Killing Bin Laden without a trial was bullshit and murdering civilians on mere suspicion of intent to break US laws in the future is also bullshit. The DNC is not "the left", they are an authoritarian right wing party. Hope this helped you.
Correct! But the Left didn't kill Bin Laden. DEVGRU SEALs killed Bin Laden with Intel from water boarding! LOL 😂🤣😂 But Obama went against all Leftist bullshit and did the right thing. Good for him! Violated "international law". I approve, because there is no such thing! (it's why there are wars) AND I am against the Left wanting our military to be pussies, correct. (the Bin Laden raid an exception - Obama did it for politics) The question is this. I supported killing Bin Laden AND these cartel strikes - because I have a pro-American national security worldview. The Left supported the Bin Laden raid because Obama was President. They would have accused Trump of war crimes. Why is that?
They're hypocrites, no doubt. They want to bitch about these boat bombings but had no problem with Obama ordering the assassinations of American citizens.
Isn’t the Geneva Convention the reason we haven’t won a war since 1945? Even now if Israel wanted Iran defeated they should destroy water and power. Thats exactly how wars are won. What’s obviously failed is blowing up a few things and then building schools, sending food, and for what? Enemies learn nothing that way.
Pete is that you?
ESAD
Oh boy Matt....are really jumping on the Henny Penny train? First off.....if this was REALLY a big deal, why did it take sooooooo long to say anything about it? It's almost they went digging to find something. As far as 'experts,' 'legal analysts,' etc.....did we not learn our lesson in COVID about people all too willing to share their opinions?
Just sayin.....let's just slow the fuck down here....and really, I think most Americans share my sentiment of 'they were fucking drug dealers, so fucking what?' It comes back to the old thing that has been eroding America.....everyone is all worried about legality when it comes to hurting a voluntary criminal, but never worried about what those criminals do to the people who aren't criminals.
Easy way to avoid getting blown up on a drug boat.....don't get in it. Don't start driving it towards the US.
I don't CARE if they did it intentionally or not. And these people do not in any way compare to the people killed at My Lai. Those people killed there were obviously civilians. The people on the drug running boats are obviously drug runners....and we are going to equivocate them?
"Obviously drug runners." You deduced that from your couch at home watching the video on Fox?
I don't watch FOX....I don't watch CNN....I don't watch NBC, ABC or CBS. I watch YouTube TV, which has all manner of videos from every side. They are obvious drug runners. Y'all's little smirking insults don't work anymore. Nobody cares what you think...we are tired of people like YOU trying to bully everyone from seeing the actual truth. Y'all had your 15 minutes, now slink back into the shadows.
Ah I see. YouTubeTv gives you all the evidence you need. Yeah, I’m smirking.
Hey man, unlike that fake lamestream news, Youtube is on the internet, and we know that if it's on the internet, it's totally true.
"They are obvious drug runners." -- Please, tell us how it is so "obvious."
They are in specially outfitted boats with 4 high powered engines and no fishing gear. There are no boat races near where they are speeding through the ocean. They don't have living quarters, so not yachts. The boats contain bales or barrels of material that completely fill the hull. If they AREN'T running drugs, what ARE they doing? Delivering talcum powder?
So... all CIRCUMSTANTIAL and speculative. Got it.
Said, no doubt by someone that believed E. Jeanne Carrol......or Blasey-Ford.
Obviously people just out for a joy ride in their fancy motor boat...
I think they were on a three hour tour
A three hour tour…
The weather started getting rough
The tiny ship was tossed
If not for the courage of the fearless crew
That drug boat would be lost
I deduced that they certainly weren't clandestine drug runners...from MY couch.
Why do we have to care for criminals? Sorry, there are so many Americans that deserve our attention. My personal opinion here..the Epstein, MRI stories are busts. They did go digging and found this new story. The WAPO, who is famous for anonymous sourcing, released. That in itself should make us pause.
How do you know they were criminals? Because Pete Hegseth said they were?
To all those bashing Matt, we don't need to be throwing personal insults just because we disagree with him. He did research, he stated his conclusions with his (as usual) entertaining writing style. (He even warned us a few days ago he'd be taking a new tack likely to piss everyone off.) Fine to disagree with his level of concern (I don't share it myself) but no need for trash talk. We wouldn't love Matt so much if he were a Sean Hannity clone.
Agree with you 100% and disagree with Matt's perspective here 100%, but I appreciate his reporting. He's one of the few journalists we have left.
This^ . Matt is a national treasure.
Agree 10000%.
Matt is a national treasure.
Not sure I can ever recall Matt creating a bigger steaming pile. Here's a different take from a man who knows. https://www.dailywire.com/news/cornell-law-professor-shreds-entirely-unconvincing-war-crime-accusation-against-hegseth?utm_content=15920025&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter&utm_source=iterable
That guy is quoted in the piece.
What I would love to know is the ideological mix of your readership pre- and post-Twitter Files.
Like Stevie Ray said, you are stranded, caught in the crossfire. The regular Dems think you've gone MAGA, as do the MAGA folks who thought you had become one of them. Don't pay none of them no mind, and keep doing what you do, brother.
Then maybe you didn't hear and understand what he was saying. I have a hard time understanding where you're coming from on this issue.
This is a great write up, and great addition to this conversation. Thank you for sharing.
Thank you for sharing this. As a total layperson in the business of news and politics, it's so hard to discern the truth. My heartstrings tug when I think of killing survivors, and then I think, wait, in war, with brutal enemies (in this case, drug smugglers who seem to be indirectly killing hundreds of thousands), the goal is elimination. War is brutal. Humans are wicked. It's a mess out there.
Drug smugglers are criminals, not soldiers. It's not war.
If they are facilitating crimes on American soil (and themselves facilitated by a foreign state), but never actually enter American territory, are we to leave them untouched, and thus leave ourselves subject to their hostile actions? It seems like critical law does not apply here. It does seem like the laws of war are more applicable. It would be nice if we had clarity about when we are at war, and with whom, and how it has been constitutionally declared.
A rare bit of slop from you. I won't bother to take it apart, your analogies are absurd. If the boat still contained drugs that could be salvaged, it could legally be hit again no matter who was clinging to it. Double taps were/are the norm on the GWOT. I'm normally a huge fan but this piece is a stack of blather and nonsense.
Sorry, I just don’t buy that drug dealers are terrorists who can be summarily executed. That’s law enforcement and we can easily board/seize these boats. I didn’t think this was legit with “terror suspects” in Pakistan either. I looked for lawyers who agreed with the administration and found one, printing his point of view, but I don’t see it.
Sorry Matt but calling powerful drug cartels simple "drug dealers" is ridiculous. Their weaponry and resources are larger than some countries. Their political connections south of the border are mind boggling. They are bringing drugs into the US that can kill every one of us many times over. The "war on drugs" is finally becoming a war and many of us are thankful for it.
We don't know who was killed in these boats, or what their crime was. For all we know they were coerced by the cartels into getting on them. And now, if the cartels are sly, they'll load them up with women and children.
The US government thinks they can execute anyone they want (even citizens) as long as they are not within US borders. This started openly with Obama's drone program. Trump is just continuing the tradition. We are living in dangerous times.
Are you volunteering to go arrest these fine people in the boats? I thought not.
Unless Amos tells us different, he's neither a Coast Guard nor a law enforcement officer. So your "why don't YOU go arrest them?" is kind of childish.
Well, they're not in the United States jurisdiction, so no.
You can wait for them to enter US waters. We'll wait.
Good luck!
Interesting that the kill ‘em all hard ons like Mike M have fuck all to say about the demand side of the equation. Why not start firing missiles at every junkie wandering around the streets of Goodle USA?🇺🇸
Ha! My point (apparently too subtle) was that drug cartels are several orders of magnitude more serious than your average drug dealer. Basically at the same level as terrorists when it comes to arms, people, tactics and political connections - which was the comparison that Matt was not making in his comment.
Junkies are not... but they definitely need to be arrested and detoxed.
All the dealers in between the cartels and the streets also need to be imprisoned.
See? I'm not a "kill 'em all" guy.
But let's talk about JP Daly... what if anything do you recommend the US government do about cartels? Specifically. And how do you think it will differ from all the previous actions over the last 40 years?
What I suggest Mike is that you include the demand side in your thinking (not that you’ve impressed me as a thoughtful man); then you issue a broad warning to drug runners. Attempt to import drugs into the USA and you will be shot on sight.
Take one step back…
Make that the law. Importing drugs into the USA is a capital offence. Further; write into that legislation that drug smugglers will be summarily executed. No trial.
Then present the evidence.
The reason you’re an asshole Mike is that you imply (every time you open your pie hole) that you’re on the right side. But you’re obviously too fucking lazy to BE on the right side.
Here's a crazy idea - legalize ALL drugs. Poof, cartels gone. Poof, dealers gone. Poof, drug crime gone. Poof, drug-RELATED crimes (burglaries/muggings/theft, gang warfare/shootings) gone (because prices would plummet). Poof, related government corruption gone. I bet you have no idea how many societal institutions (police, lawyers, judges, mayors, legislators, private prison systems, military leaders, intelligence and regulatory agencies, etc) actually benefit/profit from the drug "war" due to drugs being illegal.
Then, divert drug war-appropriated funding (and private prison subsidies) into prevention-focused education of potential users, and rehab/jobs programs for current users. Food for thought.
Mike you’re pulling this staff right down your Hershey Highway and dumping out…
You’re an immoral guy. By definition. I would bet you’re the guy running his mouth about the constitution and the rule of law etc.
Am I wrong?
Or are you really Billy The Kid?
Guys like you are budgie birds minus the cutle and feathers. Terrorist!! Squawwwkkk!
Easily convinced. Got any evidence you can offer that these men were running drugs? Mikey?
Not talking about Hegseth says. Trump says. Evidence?
No.
Like I said Mikey. You’re immoral. Wrong on the facts. Wrong on the ethics. Wrong.
Bye bye, troll.
I agree 100% with Mike M.
Matt
appreciate all the work and certainly your thoughtful views, as you can appreciate your audience of the same.
If drug dealers are not terrorists, what are they? Pick another word from the thesaurus. I lean towards killers of US citizens.
Then what ever your word is, we are at war with them! And I believe we need to do whatever is needed to stop the assault on our citizens, before those people make landfall.
I believe it is a waste of time to:
send a cutter to pick them up, arrest them, motor them to the nearest US dock, drive them to jail, feed them, allow phone calls, afford them a visit with a judge, have their -US paid defense councils do their bidding with the judge, have them released in their own recognizance, or stay longer in our jail etcccc, then 18-24 months later, have said judge and jury perhaps find them innocent of "killing citizens" because they did not actually give the poison to our people, merely dropped it on shore etcccc. And if by some miracle they are found guilty of something, they sit in our jails getting all the free stuff their country does not provide them, and they get multiple appeals etc.
Dropping one or two bombs on the boat, as needed to sink the vessel, destroy the cargo and eliminate the "threat" , is much preferred by me, and I sleep very well at night, despite too much wine sometimes.
All this was fine when other presidents/admins did it, but not for #47. so sad.
They’re businessmen. They are meeting a demand in a market. They would be powerless if the demand didn’t exist. They would not smuggle drugs if that demand didn’t exist. The demand is the problem here, and it’s a problem that exists within American culture.
Bradley, try doing some volunteer work with drug addicts. They perhaps innocently tried drugs, probably like we all did. But, when you spend time with those that would cut their right arm off to quit but can’t, your eyes open. They are literally doing drugs against their will. Most will die because they can’t quit. The drugs are being created to be super addictive.
I don't know if he's blaming everything on users, just pointing out that it is, indeed, a demand issue. Just like abortion--the states with the least effective sex education lead the nation in teen pregnancy. And they try to outlaw the supply, but do nothing for the demand.
I know all about drug addiction, having lost a brother to it. Bombing motorboats in the Caribbean is doing jack shit to stop drug addiction. It's just murder for murder's sake.
Completely agree. The drug epidemic is the result of spiritual and moral decay - and the endless wars (on terror, drugs, Putin etc.) contribute to the moral decay and squander resources that could go towards rebuilding/ repairing our society. America’s #1 priority, for some bizarre reason, is stuff outside our borders. No wonder our home is decaying.
I am sorry about your loss.
Kind of like drugs flooding our streets .
it starts with a personal decision, Marie. Practically everyone starts voluntarily, and that's a situation that doesn't bear any resemblance to being strafed by a machine gun. And even in the case of lethally dangerous drugs, most of the users are not addicts. As with alcohol use, 20% of the user population accounts for more than 80% of the demand. The users surveys make that clear. Perhaps that's why the Trump administration has worked to defund SAMHSA.
Businessmen don’t typically dismember you when you F up or steal their shit.
That’s right, blame the victim. I bet you blame women for getting raped.
He didn't blame anyone. He just stated a clear, obvious truth: drugs can't be solved by going after the supply side.
Bullshit. If there were no supply of drugs then no one could ever get addicted to them. You have to go after both supply and demand. But you damn liberals don't want to us to do anything. You give out free needles to drug addicts instead of putting them in rehab. You refuse to do "Say No To Drugs" programs. How does that reduce the demand? Then you say not to go after the suppliers. How does that solve the problem? It doesn't.
And he did blame someone, the "American culture". In other words every American. So I guess America is the only country that has any drug use. You damn liberals just can't help yourself, you just have to blame Americans for everything.
"They're businessmen" he says. No, they run an international drug cartel selling drugs that they know have killed and will kill hundreds of thousands of people worldwide. They are murderers. You damn liberals don't give a damn about the people they kill. Only those poor innocent "unarmed drug dealers" as Matt Taibbi calls them. You damn liberals are EVIL.
Don't ask stupid questions. Drug manufacturers and smugglers are fulfilling a demand in a market. People manufacture poisons all the time, chemicals which are far more deadly than drugs, and nobody is seeking to assassinate the businessmen who manufacture them. If someone ingests poison on purpose, that's their problem. The same logic applies to drugs. Killing the manufacturers will not eliminate the demand for drugs. Many addicts would literally die of withdrawal if they don't get the chemicals on which they are dependent. Bombing motorboats in the Caribbean is the most sadistic, evil, and ineffective method of solving the drug problem in America. You people who defend this are fucking nuts. Psychopaths.
it’s a statement of fact. Drug dealers are Al Capone. Not Osama bin Laden.
I have two words for drug dealers: drug dealers. This idea that everyone who does anything bad or unlawful is a terrorist is ludicrous. It also doesn’t fit any legal definition of terrorism.
This was not fine when other administrations did it. Obama's drone program comes to mind.
nothing happened from it, to obama or his secdef (secwar)
And nothing will happen to Trump or Hegseth.
Doesn’t anybody care about the hundreds of thousands of people who are killed and will be killed by these “drug dealers”? Or is this just politics as usual?
you’re missing the part of the decision chain that includes the users making their own decision to use the drugs.
That doesn’t in any way resemble someone getting blown up by a bomb, or shot, or stabbed.
Come on. This is basic.
Richard, you don’t even know they are drug dealers. Why are you suddenly trusting the government? Have you been asleep for the past 25 years as the government designated an ever-widening circle of individuals and entities “terrorists” - and squandered more and more of your tax money “fighting” them?
interesting name you have, is that a name of a salad or something I recall.
anyway
our troops have physically gone to the blown up boat sites and have confirmed drugs were on the vessels.
I believe this is a fight we need to continue as we do very little relative to the supply side, while weakliy trying to staunch or lower the demand side. We give addicts too much leeway and not enough consequences.
To be clear personal suffering and continued drug use are NOT consequences for drug addicts. These are simply "the fruits of their bad decisions".
As some have said, "addicts cant stop" or maybe, we make it too easy to not stop. Real consequences are incarceration, perhaps some slow form of withdrawl management, cold turkey stop for some. I dont purport to know all the details of addiction and you can yell at me if you want for "being ignorant". I do know that punishing bad behavior (drug making, drug running, illegal drug use etc) is a deterrent.
Perhaps the most public/strongest form is a bomb on a boat to perhaps dissuade others. If not, at least we slightly reduced the number of drug runners.
It is a tough situation to be sure. I fully support taking action on sea and on land against the illegal drug cartels/industry/runners that are wreaking havoc on our population. Will we get it 100% right NO. Sorry for what we get wrong but that is life in the drug biz.
The folly of the Drug War is the conceit that legal penalties play some crucial role in “deterring” decisions by people to use lethally dangerous drugs. We have decades on end of evidence to the contrary. Understand the risky preconditions under which people are using them: they’re purchasing a product of unknown purity and quantity that might kill them. Every new purchase of a lethally dangerous drug carries that risk. If that reality isn’t deterring someone from voluntarily choosing to use a dangerous drug, the legal risks aren’t going to deter them.
“Not enough consequences”? Really?
This is not the same thing as saying that society should tolerate public drug use, or ignore enforcement of the laws against shoplifting, car-break-ins, ignoring curfews in public parks, or any of the other malum in se criminal offenses committed by dysfunctional drug abusers and addicts. But drug use is not a criminal behavior in itself, and it’s been a huge mistake to treat it that way. Personal possession of alcohol was not criminalized during alcohol Prohibition. User criminalization would not have deterred users, it would have made the situation ten times worse.
As for the illicit market: any honest assessment has to include both sides of a prohibition policy: criminal penalties do work to keep many people out of the business of supplying the demand. But they also amount to conceding a career criminal monopoly over the supply of the forbidden substance. That means that drug dealers are subject to arrest and conviction for unscrupulously providing unsafe substances to an unregulated consumer market. A market of people voluntarily purchasing the substance, at their own risk. An official U.S. government policy that classifies drug dealers as terrorists is ridiculous. And if its faulty logic is accepted, that policy will be applied within U.S. borders.
"Perhaps the most public/strongest form is a bomb on a boat to perhaps dissuade others." -- Then we'd have to bomb commercial and military aircraft out of the sky, as well. You do know drugs also enter our country that way, no?
sure 😂 The government told us so… We now finally know the real reason behind the conflict with Venezuela- oil. But keep trusting the experts!
Do you honestly think bombing a few boats will have any impact whatsoever on the drug supply? The CIA burnt down fucking hundreds of acres of coca plants in Columbia and all it did was shift production to Bolivia. The drug war is a demand problem. If there is demand, supply will find a way. The only solution is to end the drug war and legalize and regulate like alcohol and cannabis. It’s the least bad solution.
Matt is spot on in his analysis. Killing drug traffickers in international waters is not armed conflict. Not by any stretch of the imagination. And if you start defining terrorist and armed conflict so broadly it’s not too far to consider the same rules of engagement at home with citizens. How is this any different than bombing a truck on a highway in California. Do you think our government should be doing that as well?
Great minds, wrt legalizing. I just posted something similar further up this thread.
yeah, international waters are where you can beta test your rocket strikes all nice and legal-like, as part of a publicity campaign to equate illicit drug marketing organizations with armed terrorist groups.
What is the difference? Please elaborate. Is there a law I don’t know about? An ethical principle? What am I missing
"If drug dealers are not terrorists, what are they?" -- Look up the definition of terrorism. No, dealers are more akin to entrepreneurs, as they run a business with the intent of making money, not with the intent of terrorizing and killing people. That may be a consequence of their business, but it's also a consequence of the quite legal pharmaceutical and other industries.
hey gang, and I dont use gang in a "gang" sense, assuming y'all can differentiate this from me.
Unless or until, the drug dealers/terrorists/ drug runners/narco terrorists etc , step foot on US soil, I am fully supportive of our government/agencies/military taking these folks "out".
Sure we have done nefarious deeds over the years, sorry. (btw both sides of the aisle are culpable).
One said "drug dealers" are in biz because we have addicts.
Well the US has done little to cure addiction. So since we have fallen short of curing addiction, it is ok to bring drugs to America? I say NO.
Do what we need to do to stop the flow of drugs into the US. Outside our borders it is fair game/open season. Beg for forgiveness later, if needed.
Til then bomb the hell out of the dealers.
take care
rich
Dude, take a step back. YOU are the one advocating for terrorism. Going around the world blowing people from other countries up because we have a problem with them and their governments? That’s called terrorism.
You conflate bombing people with doing what it takes to end drugrunning, but bombing obciously and naturally increases terrorism, which funds itself by drugrunning. You are calling for more drugs and drug dealers. Thats the whole point, it doesnt work the way you want it to.
There's no analogy here. What are you talking about?
It won't take very many strikes to bring an end to fentanyl injection by speedboat . That's the point.
Fentanyl doesn’t come from Venezuela chief. It comes from China via Mexico
I’ve never seen a speedboat injecting anyone with drugs. People run away from bullets and bombs and shrapnel. Illicit drug users run toward dealers, with wads of cash in their hand. And then they use the drugs themselves. Which are risky, but not to be compared with hot lead. No one is forcing them to do it. The coercion is all going the other way.
I used to believe something like what you say. Seeing strung out druggies die in the street (I saw it in Portland) has greatly weakened my former libertarianism.
what, am I supposed to be impressed? Are you also a paid subscriber to Kevin Dahlgren's Substack, like I am? I drove the night shift for years on end, and you think you can lecture me based on some inside personal observations?
I challenge you to round me up some junkies who blame their habits on the evil drug dealer terrorists who force them to keep taking drugs.
Some drug markets need to be illegal. Cocaine, strong opioids, fentanyl. But drug dealing is not terrorism. It isn't to be used as an excuse to push the envelope of officially ordered murders.
Once the logical premises of the Trump administration's justification are accepted, the door is opened to a police state. No take-backs.
Is it a waste of time to arrest, charge, and try criminals in the United States? Should the US military and police just summarily execute anyone suspected of wrongdoing?
Are we also at “war” with the sackler family?
No jail, only country clubs for the “dealers” for pharma.
Nothing New folks, just the same bomb/drug /sex economy, we have been exporting for 50 years…
“We the people” to addicted to change..
Drugs kill both Americans and illegal aliens, who are useful, inexpensive workers. So these are terrorists on hotels and car washes and are harming the economy! All this legal mumbo jumbo is a cumbersome waste of time when we need to protect our drug takers.
40 years I’ve been hearing about the US WAR ON DRUGS….does it need to be defined?
it would be educational to hear you try.
Have you read the letter from Major General Hugo Carvajal. It’s compelling.
We’re twisting around the axle of defining ‘terrorism’, which is far as I know does not have an agreed-upon definition. What we do know is that there is a supply problem and a demand problem. One ‘would think’ that the drug dealers are now reconsidering the value proposition of getting into their 1000hp boats with a load of drugs and heading our way. (I am glad the MSM has stopped insulting the intelligence of some of us and calling these vessels and their occupants ‘fisherman’. Trolling and long-lining at 70 mph…..right….). There is not, and probably never will be, the institutional courage to address the demand problem. Cases in point - nicotine addiction and the movement from cigarettes to vapes. It won’t be too many more years before the public health hell that vapes cause will become apparent, and cost ALL of us. Now we have weed for sale that is X times more potent than was sold on the ‘black market’ not that long ago. Legalizing these drugs will just multiply the number of people face down on the sidewalk. Corporate food - no courage or foresight there either. Our country was far worse off than others during covid because we are generally fat and really unhealthy. Soon enough the excitement over this will pass and there will be a new flavor of the day to try to make the current administration look bad, only because it’s the current administration doing “it”, regardless of how consistent the actions are with prior administrations.
"We’re twisting around the axle of defining ‘terrorism’, which is far as I know does not have an agreed-upon definition." -- I think the dictionary would beg to differ.
"Trolling and long-lining at 70 mph…..right…." -- So, boats going that fast can only be carrying drugs, and for no other reason?
I couldn’t have said it better myself!!!! Thank you!
The War on Drugs is 54 years old. Started by Nixon. Drug cartel leaders “kingpins” are targeted and killed by government operations. The alphabet agencies do a lot of these missions, most that we never hear about. Unfortunately, because of TDS, there are no secrets in DC. Everything that can cause harm to this administration will be anonymously released. Does it matter if we blow up a drug cartel boat in the Caribbean or go into Mexico and murder a kingpin? I bet there’s a treasure trove of murderous info that has taken place over 54 years that would make the bleeding hearts go away crazy. If we can find a way to stop these drugs from killing our children’s, I’m in.
Look at this as an Intelligence Test, readers:
“Drug cartel leaders “kingpins” are targeted and killed by government operations. The alphabet agencies do a lot of these missions, most that we never hear about.”
So, Marie. how have you heard about it, then?
Anyway, what’s up with the Honduran guy who just got released from prison, Hernandez? He was part of a ring that smuggled an estimated 550 tons of cocaine:
From 2022, the Wall Street Journal, Kate Linebaugh: “Hernandez is facing charges in the US that he took bribes from Latin American drug cartels and helped them smuggle 550 tons of cocaine to the US. Hernandez has denied the charges. It was a stunning turn of events for the former president, who ran the country for eight years on a platform of stamping out corruption and standing up to drug cartels.” https://www.wsj.com/podcasts/the-journal/bribes-cartels-and-extradition-how-a-honduran-president-became-a-us-target/f080d435-813a-41e5-b9f5-8c37668366a9?gaa_at=eafs&gaa_n=AWEtsqeXJAF-45iYjuO4bDyZ0DBaml_6L4G_-sco4sBzu2bSF5eqoS-VelfuZOiOKGs%3D&gaa_ts=692c5ccb&gaa_sig=y89XU-RozUm7fuv6ohdA0YB4D6m-6PGZvTfJr5YbS31UArgcDlzuoR_uebK-rhl0ai6nQbuStWZ-5_ZHDw0fPw%3D%3D
And President Trump pardoned him. Not just clemency, he pardoned him.
But back to your original claim: if the US Government has been assassinating “drug cartel leaders “kingpins”” for the past 54 years, why hasn’t the assassination squad project succeeded yet?
Assassination squad, 😀don’t think I ever said those words. I feel I may have hit a nerve. Look, it’s true we been fighting this war on drugs for 50 years. I don’t know the in and outs, but most likely if one “kingpin” is removed there’s a line ready to replace. I’m sitting in a spot that basically doesn’t care if we blow up some drug boats. Right or wrong, I just don’t care. I’m sick of what it’s doing to our youth. Some kid takes a pill one night for kicks and it’s laced with some shit that kills him. Should he have taken it, no. But I did plenty of stupid crap when I was young, but this lethal crap was not something to worry about back then. It’s a new ball game.
Your statement that "Drug cartel leaders “kingpins” are targeted and killed by government operations" does fit the dictionary definition of "assassination", yes.
You sound like you don't realize how corrupt the drug game is, Marie. Granting extraordinary powers to the government on the basis of a phony equation of "drug dealers" and "terrorists" is exactly how we end up with a death squad police state.
After 54 years, don’t you think it’s time to try something new? We’re doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. Every kingpin we take out just creates a power vacuum for a new one to emerge. Sounds like a dumb strategy
Your argument assumes drugs were on these boats. Where's the evidence? And no, "Trump/Rubio/Hegseth said so" is not evidence.
NY Post today reported drug boats seized. Coast guard helicopter blew up their engines, then coast guard vessel boarded boat. They seized cocaine, a lot. Look it up.
That's about a different recent incident. I'm asking for evidence from the bombed boats in September.
https://nypost.com/2025/12/06/us-news/coast-guard-helicopter-sniper-takes-out-narco-boat-during-operation-pacific-viper-seizes-cocaine/
That shows you that the ordinary interdiction tactics work--without going completely lawless with no due process and summary execution. You should read Jack Beavers' Substack page.
Your Rolling Stone/Mother Earth DNA on full display here. They can and should be executed. Requiring our troops to board their boats exposes them to unnecessary danger and will only lead to protracted, ultimately unsuccessful prosecutions.
Here's an article about reality. https://asiatimes.com/2025/09/was-the-venezuela-gangs-fast-boat-crew-bent-on-terrorism/
thanks for sharing
By that logic, we should just execute every American who commits a crime to avoid any "protracted, ultimately unsuccessful prosecutions." Heck, think of all the taxpayer money we could save doing away with our entire justice system.
Easily board a small boat going up to 90 knots? Former vessel boarding officer. Here's the reality about these go-fast drug running boats. https://asiatimes.com/2025/09/was-the-venezuela-gangs-fast-boat-crew-bent-on-terrorism/
Dated info I think. These boats are now capable of doing 130mph. We have no USCG or Navy craft that can go that fast. And even if they did running alongside them with a megaphone yelling "Hey guys can you slow down....what are your names..we need to know your names first...oh, are those drugs...could you pull over please we just want to inspect? Doesn't work sending a message via a lethal air strike force will get the word out. The number of boats is already down. Feckless Democrat politicians and their lying mockingbirds in the press haven't a clue what an effective war on drugs needs to look like.
They just disabled another board today. Coast guard helicopter took out engines, then coast guard boarded vessel. Seized cocaine.
Let’s assume this happened, which is one of the jobs of the CG. A helicopter was involved and that means a limited range. The CG has approximately 147 helicopters covering the entire US coastline. To operate with a greater range, a cutter that can carry a helicopter must be used. This further limits those types of operations.
Citation?
Yeah, we could capture them. They would then be let back out on the street by a liberal judge and back into another boat in short order. How is that a deterrent?
I disagree on the point that drug cartels are not terrorists. How is importing large quantities of a deadly substance into the U.S. and distributing it, resulting in thousands of ongoing deaths not a terrorist act? If not, exactly how would the analysis be different if they were importing anthrax? I will agree that the double tap events, if proven, are a huge problem legally, morally, and just as bad PR. So I guess I get the honor along with Matt of pissing off everyone at once.
Many, many, many, many Americans want the products the cartels provide. No American wanted what Osama bin Laden had for us.
Everyone has forgotten the definition of "terrorism."
How would the analysis be different if they were importing anthrax? American recreational anthrax use is pretty low and tends not to be voluntary. Didn't really "catch on" as a party drug for some reason.
I like that you didn’t apologize for your opinion, even though we likely diverge at some point.
By that logic, we'd also need to designate as 'terrorist organizations' the pharmaceutical and other companies whose products have resulted "in thousands of ongoing deaths."
Drug dealers and terrorists use the same tactic Matt, fear. It ensures their users/victims never have the opportunity to fight back with equal or superior force. Taking either of them out before they harm more innocents isn't necessarily a bad thing. For example, how many of these narco-boats were flying their country's flag so we could assess if they were 'friendlies' or not? If no flag, aren't they by international rules, pirates? How many friendly pirates have you met that follow international laws?
So if we're breaking international law in order to fight others breaking international law, it's OK?
Didn't your mom ever tell you about the "two wrongs don't make a right" deal?
"two wrongs don't make a right", except when dealing with drugs. And maybe some orher situations not part of this discussion. ...
Matt
Comparing this to the post 9/11 reaction is a real stretch. We're talking about surgical precision strikes against gangsters delivering poison in international waters, not the Patriot Act or regime change.
This is analogous to how the US dealt with the Barbary pirates.
Actually, we are talking about regime change, as that is the REAL objective of this whole ordeal.
Many of us are not on board with you on this one, but I appreciate your take/stance entirely. I think about some of the Asian countries' zero-tolerance drug policies as opposed to the toothless and pointless "war on drugs" the US follows. Arresting the drug runners, going to trial, half-assed sentences..rinse and repeat. And the drugs keep flowing with zero consequences to all parties involved except the users and society in general.
Again, I appreciate you focusing on this. It helped me think a little more deeply. I don't want an audience captured Matt ever.
But the law disagrees with you. I actually share your reservations about the entire enterprise, whether a terrorist or not. But here we are.
That said, I've been studying up on our operations against the massive cartes and their transshipment operations. A military type of response seems justified.
What I'd prefer is legislation from that broken institution, congress, authorizing use of force in specific ways for specific intentions. But hey, that's not possible in a late stage empire in the midst of a slow motion collapse. Our governing elite can't muster up the coherent, moral and patriotic will to work together and govern sensibly.
Again, so here we are...I remain a huge admirer and very much appreciate the response.
The cartels gruesomely murder anyone who stands up to them or for the rule of law. How is that not terroristic behavior?
So did Tony Soprano and his boys. Are they also terrorists now?
Tony Soprano performatively murdered cops, judges, lawmakers, mayors and journalists in order to demonstrate that he and his boys were in charge, not they? I must have missed that.
Take another gander at the dictionary definition of 'terrorism.'
I'll also add that it's clear to me that the 40 year LE effort has failed and that the host nation govts can't or won't eliminate the cartels. I'm not willing to see our SpecOps folks used to kill goat-herders halfway around the world while we let these animals wild on uw.
ruh roh
The Coast Guard does board and seize boats all the time. Drones and helicopters are used on the fast boats that are too fast, too maneuverable and can go in shallower waters. It's not like the Coast Guard isn't at work here. It would be interesting to know how the crews seized by the CG are handled.
Laws are for cowardly pussies. Our American drug takers lives are at stake! Suspected drug dealers or "mules" should be strung up like suspected cattle wraslers or whatever they were called. Frontier justice will save American lives and end drug use forever.
How about checking with some coast guard officials about how easy it is to board these boats?
Matt, these are not pot-smoking "drug dealers" selling dime bags to high school kids at carnivals. These drugs have killed hundreds of thousands of young American citizens. The utter disregard for these lives is astounding. This is unbelievable!!
Welp, I guess we should just bomb into oblivion the pharmaceutical companies making, and pharmacies distributing, all the opioids killing "hundreds of thousands of young American citizens" as well.
if you can’t understand the difference between Al Capone and Osama bin Laden, you’re in no position to criticize someone else’s analogies as “absurd.”
Yes, drug dealers are criminal outlaws, subject to arrest and felony conviction for unscrupulously providing unsafe substances to an unregulated consumer market. A market of people voluntarily purchasing the substance, at their own risk. An official U.S. government policy that classifies drug dealers as terrorists is ridiculous. And if its faulty logic is accepted, that policy will be applied within U.S. borders.
LE has failed to deal with this massive threat fpr 40 years.
I don’t like the term terrorist to begin with and lumping all those threats together in that way. But it’s what we have. We can get away with calling them terrorists legally, so I say fine. The Cartels have military style, nation-state defying militant capacity. And the economics to pay for it.
In a narrow sense, I get your point and ‘agree’ with it. But we live in an imperfect world with imperfect laws. The Cartels running amok in South America are an ongoing crime against humanity so I’m cool with whatever legal gymnastics need to be done to destroy them.
Consider the guy who Donald Trump just pardoned: Juan Orlando Hernandez, former President of Honduras.
From the Wall Street Journal, March 31, 2022: "(Hernandez is facing charges in the US that he took bribes from Latin American drug cartels and helped them smuggle 550 tons of cocaine to the US. Hernandez has denied the charges. It was a stunning turn of events for the former president, who ran the country for eight years on a platform of stamping out corruption and standing up to drug cartels."
Hernandez was eventually convicted, of course. Before Trump pardoned him, a year later.
https://www.wsj.com/podcasts/the-journal/bribes-cartels-and-extradition-how-a-honduran-president-became-a-us-target/f080d435-813a-41e5-b9f5-8c37668366a9?gaa_at=eafs&gaa_n=AWEtsqeXJAF-45iYjuO4bDyZ0DBaml_6L4G_-sco4sBzu2bSF5eqoS-VelfuZOiOKGs%3D&gaa_ts=692c5ccb&gaa_sig=y89XU-RozUm7fuv6ohdA0YB4D6m-6PGZvTfJr5YbS31UArgcDlzuoR_uebK-rhl0ai6nQbuStWZ-5_ZHDw0fPw%3D%3D
Have you ever been mugged, and had that weird sense of unreality and denial about a situation unfolding before your eyes?
I've had muggers attempt to mug me three times, none were successful because I had a reaction utterly different than you describe. As for the pardon, I think it's about politics in the region, which by necessity must be 'real politik'. You've really not made a point I can sink my teeth into here.
My point was that I'm willing to use the legalistic framework of an attack by a hostile non-state force to justify using military force against these huge, multi-billion transnational criminal organizations. Another factor which drives me to this position is the failure/corruption of the national governments in these countries. They operate in cooperation with elements of the national governments in very serious ways and exercise control over
large areas inside these countries.
When I pile all this up, I'm willing to hide behind any fig leaf I can find to blow them to shit, ya? As I said upthread, I'd much rather congress pass laws and authorizations to deal with these real threats but we'll never see that. Cuz congress is broken. Not saying my position is awesome, but there it is.
Drug smuggling is not an "attack" on the US. It's just an industry that profits from selling terribly unsafe products to willing consumers. And one of the points that you've missed is that the historic corruption related to illicit drugs is not confined to south of the Texas border. What you hand-wave as "real politik" is an example of that corruption, at the highest level of the US government.
You just want to "blow [the mythic villains you've conjured] to shit" because you think that's the key to getting the rest of the world to Obey your wishes. The rest of the world keeps reminding you that that your Power To Control is limited, and you don't like that.
You don't get my analogy about the mugging because it was intended for readers other than yourself. You want to be on the mugger's side. The inauguration of a sado-moralist police state isn't viewed as a problem by the people who think they'll benefit from it.
If there's a War for the West, I'm trying to save the West from the Murphy game of criminals and seditionists who claim to be the police when they're really the muggers.
Keep repeating yourself if it makes you feel good. It is boring though…
Cocaine, I corrected myself two times already
I worked CT/CN (counter narcotics & terrorism) in LATAM from 1997 to 2006 (with a two-year hiatus to command a Harrier squadron and deploy it to Bagram in 2003). I got to see the cruelty that the FARC, ELN, and AUC exacted upon poor farmers and their children (machete amputations of ears and tips of noses). Like all commissioned officers, I was trained in the Law of Armed Conflict, the UCMJ, and attendant ROE & RUF. I hate the narcos to the marrow of my bones. I also despise the complicit press and their disinterest in deviations from legal use of force when Obama did it.
I am bone weary of fighting gang, terrorist, cartel, and their enablers with one hand tied behind our back. They are becoming more aggressive and sophisticated, while leftist apologists run interference for them. In this environment, the good guys can’t win, and the bad guys make the world worse.
Thank you.
I wish for all to understand the distinction that I draw between moral philosophy and the rule of law. Law is constantly perverted, and not just in the U.S. International conventions are a mess. They begin to resemble a Rorschach ink blot inasmuch as political ideologues and power centers leverage law to serve their parochial power purposes. Laws have migrated from morality to the degree that it’s against the law to pronounce “Arkansas” incorrectly. In Connecticut, pickles cannot be sold unless they “bounce.” I won’t bore you with further legal idiocy.
In this military case, we are addressing nationally sanctioned killing of narcoterrorists who are paid to facilitate drug exportation and kill people while imagining that they are noncombatants. Leftist assertions that these are “just criminals” worthy of due process, completely ignore the human suffering that the activity of these parasites impose upon humans in both the precursor and destination states. This is such an old argument, and honest people disagree. Our enemies exploit our devotion to the rule of law in order to defeat us.
To those who demand that WE be punished for killing cockroaches, I wish to learn their strategy for ending the narcotic subversion of the USA. I demand victory, not surrender to the scum of the earth.
ideology has nothing to with the facts of the case. You're indulging in pettifoggery. A version of Critical Theory. Abstraction and Semantic redefinitions, manipulating language elasticity until you can can get to the Desired Result. Whereas actual critical thinking relies on facts about specific cases, and logical inferences about precedent incidents. And the baseline honesty to recognize the difference between an illicit global market with a demand that's only too popular worldwide, vs. an armed political insurgency targeting the United States.
As I'm taking you at your word, stay tuned for a brief flyer about the uh SOUTHCOM situation representation, with some background. I'll be posting it here. It's all unclassified. Yet somehow very secret, can you beat that? I need some time to write it, luckily I have some.
Or you could take this as an early notice to block me. I've never blocked anyone. But I'm aware that people do.
I don’t lose sleep over social media antagonists. It wouldn’t cross my mind to block you…or anybody. It seems that you have experience with being blocked. I don’t.
While I’m up, here’s something that you may find interesting reading: annual survey reports on the use of drugs, including prescription pills, alcohol and tobacco—including last 7 days; last 30 days; previous 12 months. Two different reports- one for high school students surveying use for 8th graders, 10th graders, and 12th graders; and the survey for users age 19-65.
The surveys have been done by the University of Michigan Monitoring The Future program since the mid-1970s. Every annual report between the years 1975 and 2024 is available to read for free. This is the longest running survey available. https://monitoringthefuture.org/results/annual-reports/
https://monitoringthefuture.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/12/mtf2025.pdf (484 pages)
https://monitoringthefuture.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/07/mtfpanel2025.pdf (247 pages)
The Feds have some similar survey reports.* SAMHSA, ONDCP, CDC. But none of them go back as far as the U. Michigan Monitoring the Future reports, which cover a wide range of behaviors, not just drug use. I think the SAMHSA reports only go back to 1992 or so. I’ll find them soon. They’re a good check on the U. Michigan reports. For what it’s worth, the surveys track quite closely. It’s just that the U. Mich reports go back all the way to 1975. That improves the perspective considerably.
(*Or they used to, they may have been cut by DoGE this year.)
The weird thing about blocking people online is that only the person doing the blocking experiences it.
After around 4 years on Substack, I only found out about my being blocked by anyone a few weeks ago, by downloading the free app BlockedStack. Otherwise, I would never have known.
Now that I know, I still don't be caring.
lol, you showed up ten years after the coca trade spread from Bolivia and Peru to Colombia. And I bet you think you're a real expert in how that happened.
I suppose I'll have to assemble some facts and figures.
"Tired of fighting the cartels with one hand tied behind buh buh buh buh"
Maybe you were in Afghanistan- and oh, what a raging success that was, allying with a narco-regime- when the CIA ordered the Peruvian Air Force to shoot down a plane that carried a family of Christian missionaries. https://www.thetimes.com/world/us-world/article/how-missionary-familys-plane-was-shot-down-in-cia-blunder-cmbs7mqbv7j
You know, Smedley Butler once said that he never had an independent thought until he left the military.
Awesome Matt, you get to lead all the comments that will be quoted on CNN and MSNBC. You'll welcomed back with open arms.
Yes, but WHY is it a war crime? It's mostly a war crime because we don't want them to do it to us, i.e. that's why we created a convention and a treaty on it. But these people, unlike German and Japanese officers in the past, are never going to be in position to order their own side to do things like this.
Personally, I'm cool with it. I don't prefer it, but I'd rather worry about shooting more boats than navel gazing over this. That doesn't mean I want to do it to the Russians, because they feasibly would be in position to do it to our folks. But lawless civilians running drugs? (non-citizens, that, is, everything would be way different for Americans, or even for boats flying a national flag and following the rules)
I seriously couldn't give a fuck, and I didn't vote for Trump (or Biden or KH) and don't have a care about which way this all goes for him. I think trying out the war on drugs as an actual war is a good experiment to run.
The list of war crimes from WWII and Vietnam is long, and much of it is much, much worse than this. ONE PERSON served time over My Lai. No one could claim they were just "following orders" because all of those giving orders WERE ACQUITTED.
" But these people, unlike German and Japanese officers in the past, are never going to be in position to order their own side to do things like this." Actually Kelly one could argue that these people have already done it to us. The fact that they are shipping poison into our country killing hundreds of thousands of people is reason enough to bomb the hell out of them in my opinion.
Agreed one thousand percent. I agree that they end up killing our citizens. And yes, us not a single one of them is going to look at someone addicted to their product who is likely to die with the next hit and not sell it to them. No mercy coming our way from these fuckers. (Yes, I know this group deals in cocaine - but if you haven't hit a nightspot in a decade, there are fentanyl test strips being sold because people are dying from everything these days since it can get adulterated).
That's a good point. Direct attacks on our children.
I do enjoy how My Lai is constantly brought up as the quintessential example of "you can't use following orders as a defense" when the military court didn't find him guilty despite "just following orders", they ruled that there was no evidence such an order was given. The guy that purportedly gave the order got off scot free, was acquitted. It takes 5 minutes to learn this on Wikipedia but everyone walks around with the wrong picture in their head and spouts off on it all the time.
Oh, well, people believe that in the Bible, God told Noah to put one pair of each animal on the Ark, as well. And literally it's right in the fucking Book that he didn't. https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%207&version=NIV
Well, right before that, in vs. 19-20, God does say that:
19 And of every living thing of all flesh, you shall bring two of every sort into the ark to keep them alive with you. They shall be male and female. 20 Of the birds according to their kinds, and of the animals according to their kinds, of every creeping thing of the ground, according to its kind, two of every sort shall come in to you to keep them alive.
Here he says "build the ark like this and we're gonna take two of everything". And then he says specifically "now get on the ark with seven pairs of everything clean and two of everything else"... and then "Noah did all that the Lord commanded him"
This is at best WHY people may be confused. But they are confused. And we're taught the beginning without even a hint of controversy, difference, or the potential for additional info, which is entirely misinformation, just like all other misinfo people believe.
They took seven of every kind of incompetent bureaucrat and shot them in the head before sealing the Ark, to make sure they didn't survive the Flood.
Military convention only works when it is followed by both sides. The drug cartels are ghoulish in their treatment of their enemies and are terrorists in every sense of the word. You can wring your hands over the fineries of military justice but these animals have earned everything they’re getting. To treat them as conventional military opponents simply ignores what is necessary to fix the problem. This story is absolutely going to wither from public indifference to these attacks. They’ll likely be applauded instead. Honestly, I’d move on from this story.
I didn’t experience a whole lot of outrage in the media as in Obama was ripped for blowing past ostensible War Powers guidelines in an action that probably should be more infamous than it is. None at all really. I do get a sense that air strikes on drug laden speed boats is getting a lot more attention solely because it’s Donal Trump’s administration. I really do get that sense. Where was the media when Quadafi (sp) was blown up in Libya? (Was it his family too? I don’t remember). Where was the media when Biden blew up the Nordstream Pipeline II and then said he didn’t do it and went to extreme lengths to cover it up? The list goes on. Someone’s quoted in your article, “this is the dumbest shit he’s ever done.” Is that give the order for a second strike? Or is that start up with Venezuela and the drug cartels? You don’t specify. And a lot of experts have been and will be trotted out. More than the usual. But this particular story is the kind where the facts change daily. Were you aware there were JAG officers in on the consultation on this controversial air strike. That’s what I am told. Can you verify that? Would like to know what they said. So much I heard …. It’s been reported….here’s this experts opinion….well the two men were in the water helpless…..well the two men had climbed back on the boat and potentially could have been maybe been trying to contact other cartel boats or something….So all we’re left with is speculation. Unless we’re getting eyewitnesses accounts, and we’re not. I am confident the “experts” can recite the law and do little more than speculate on the facts. Thats what I count on independent media for a better understanding of the reality of what occurred. Give us some hard facts and a timeline. Have said that, I admire the quality and difficulty of your work.
It seems I remember Qaddafi holding his son & crying before he was eventually killed himself at a different time. Maybe my memory is off.
No you are right. Somebody corrected that earlier. The U.S. didn’t actually commit the killing. There’s others though. Greg Collard and Matt Taibbi’s most recent article. Out today goes into some of it.
"Shipwrecked." Just a bunch of vacationers on a Three Hour Tour.
Matt, your really becoming a mainstream ally . One, The story was debunked in the New York Times. two the main street media is looking for anything to try and justify the video that came out from the six idiots who told the military to ignore orders. They didn’t like. Three if the boat was not totally destroyed it and still had drugs on it it most certainly could be hit again to make sure that nobody comes out to get those drugs.
What is this Venezuelan thing about, anyway? I mean, really about? Somebody in Trump's orbit has apparently convinced him Venezuela had something to do with the 2020 election steal. Rubio has a long-standing and public animosity against the last and current Venezuelan regimes. I'm sure the fact that this is also a way to stick it to China is helpful, as well. It's got to be more than oil or drugs. Considering that Trump recently pardoned JOH, who was convicted of flooding the US with cocaine, this Venezuelan escapade can't be about drugs. Saying it's because of "narco terrorists" is like pointing at the mouse (Venezuela) in the corner and screaming about it while ignoring the massive elephant (Mexico) sitting in the middle of the room. I'm less concerned with the hypocrisy (that never changes from either side), but at the intentions and reasons behind this insanity.
Update: To those who thought including the 2020 election bullshit in this post was crazy, you were wrong. Trump has issued multiple posts today (1/5/2026) on Truth Social regarding Venezuela and the 2020 election. Open your eyes.
It’s about oil, and China not having clean access to it. The drug boats are the premise. Like the WMD’s Saddam had.
That is what I think. I thought the same about Iraq. But what do I know? I'm just a country bumpkin here.
Plus opening up the rest of Venezuela's natural resources to American corporations, as our puppet Maria Machado has promised she'll do once we've regime-changed Maduro for her.
🎯
If "drug dealers" can blow a helicopter out of the sky, at what point does this become more than law enforcement?
Agreed. If this were truly about drugs, we’d be bombing Mexico and China. This seems like Trump letting Rubio and the other south Florida neocons run amok. I wonder if by this time next year, we’ll be bombing Cuba.
I listened to Brian L Cox, a Cornell Law professor, on The Megyn Kelly Show on Monday. He had a totally different opinion that made sense to me. Respectfully, this does not. So many pundits. So little time.
He's one of the few people who really understand this. Specifically, assuming the boat was a military objective, attacks could continue until it was no longer of value to the enemy. Critics stupidly assume the attack was aimed at the people, when the objective was the boat and its cargo. (Of course we now know the WaPo report about targeting survivors clinging to wreckage was nonsense. A second attack on the vessel, yes, that happened.)
And here comes the Trump apologist brigade! If you railed against Obama for these same types of actions and ignore or hand wave these serious allegations then you're part of the problem.
Similarly, if you didn't rail against Obama for these same types of actions and all the sudden have issue with the current admin... you are part of the problem. Selective outrage works both ways... we are seeing it big time with immigration enforcement this year.
I did. The drone strikes from the Obama admin were one of the first things that made me drop the rose-colored glasses on him as a young voter at the time. Its a shame so many can turn a blind eye when its your "team". The difference here is this admin is so beyond childish with their troll-like responses to any questions.
And nuance be damned?
Yes, Obama was chief exporter..
Part of problem and proud, reporting.
(Mind you, I didn’t have an issue with Obama droning etc).
The allegations are childish if true or false, utterly irrelevant to reality. You’re children and you’d better grow up fast- it’s over.
Yet another mouth breather farts and calls it a comment. You have EXACTLY the president and puppets you deserve Speed. 😂
The military lawyers and officials Matt quoted to seem to think it more than childish allegations. Noted that you're part of the problem.
Ah, but they are children.
Perhaps you haven’t met them. They like to play with us Army men.
Which is the problem I’m part of….
Huh?
Dustin, the fact remains that you care more about these two drug cartel members than the hundreds of thousands of Americans their drugs have killed and will kill. By all means, let's keep killing our young Americans because we have to stop Trump at all costs.
This comment section is cracking me up. I never knew Taibbi had gained such a loyal crossover audience with Newsmax
It really is funny. They've taken all the great reporting he's done exposing Dem corruption at face value but, when its their boy, all of a sudden they're singing a different tune.
It’s not a different tune. We disagree with Matt’s assumptions. Notice, we have not been disparaging him. It’s called dialogue. Maybe something you’re not familiar with.
I thought we declared a War on Drugs? Seems like everyone wants to hit the fucking easy button all the time and not do the hard work and take the flack to unwind the generation of fuckery foisted upon us by the Uniparty. Looks like Matt is headed back over the fence also. Sad, really.
Kill them all, more boat strikes, faster please!!
Yeah. The “…hard work…” Kill. Ask questions (maybe) later. You just unwittingly illustrated your entire nation’s history with one comment.
Are you Canadian or worse a EU prick?
He's the guy who relies on the umbrella POF protection we provide so he can complain how we provide it!
Fuck off, eh!
This is our discussion, please go home.
I am home. And in the comments section. Foolish woman.
Then I suppose you don’t consider this YOUR national then, considering your comment.
My “national”?! Are you an English speaker?
No. You're just a douche bag. Or AI. Whoever you are, again, fuck off.
Exactly right, sir! The "War on Drugs", like the "War on Terrorism" is known by everyone with a functioning brain to be an absolute fraud and lie. The only purpose for each was to inflict violence for blatantly evil political ends. These pathetic rats cheering on the boat strikes pretend to care about the damage of drug addiction, but this has never once been a concern of right wingers. It's just what they think they have to say, right now, so they can toady for Trump. As long as the members of the Sackler family walk around free and unharmed, then every one of these Trumpies is a knowing liar.
America hater and Trump Derangement Syndrome sufferer.
I stopped reading when you said "Law professors and military analysts struggled to find words." I assumed you meant leftist attorneys and self-proclaimed "military analysts" who hate Trump.
Bingo